Rocket Boosting (was: Making A Stand! - For 2.4)

[ai]

I'd say like this: First let's try reducing it a bit and see how that plays out. How many people will complain and how many will like it. Then based on the result of that we could try removing it and see what kind of reactions are thrown at that.

I too opt for either reducing or removing. But before one options sticks I would like to try them both out and see how people adapt to the new settings

[torus]

How about we leave it up to the mapper? If the mapper thinks his map would work with rocketjumping, he would put a variable in the mapconfig.

[Red Dragon]

I voted keep.

Fast paced?
Is Nexuiz a fast paced fps or not? Removing RL-boosting will slow down ctf-gameplay, which means caps on open maps like greatwall will become impossible. And there is one simple way to stop a RLbooster especially on open those maps. That is a good sniper. I've always feared Inficios aim and even pray after a boost that he doesnt hit me.

My expirience
A few day ago i played a public ctf match vs some newbies. All of them (about 4) had MG and were camping in the base. Map was greatwall. Those who have seen me playing know how i attack there. So I attacked with 200/200 and rl. Do you really think i could escape that? No, I didnt. More than 10 times i ran into their MGs and was slaugthered. I was helpless with all my laserjumpskill and RL-BOOSTING. No single cap for me the whole match.

Without RL-boosting
On open maps there are only two weapons used: RL vs nex (or MG in 2.3)
Without RLboosting only nex. That means "greatwall == tdm minsta"
If no RL-boost, then no nex please (and MG 2.3)

Teamplay
People say it will improve teamplay. I think ctf-gameplay will be similar to desertcastle, where 5 players are attacking as a group and hardly anyone will reach the flag. Not to mention returning to base.

Maps
Bundy also told me weapons are ok, maps are not. Imho he's absolutly right. Look at capturecity. Best maps are those which are partitially indoor and outdoor (facingworlds), where EVERY weapon can be used. (Facing has still not enough indoor parts imho, but maps are another topic)

Suggestion
It should be more difficult to RL-boost (NOT weaker). Something like aiming correctly. I've always wondered why RL boosts me forward aiming forward. That is really unrealtic. (Yeah i know Nex is unrealitic). It should boost you backwards. Maybe this way boosting gets more difficult because you have to aim. Aim at the opposite direction you want to go.

Less option in a game will make it uninteressting. So please keep RL-boosting.

I hope my english isnt too bad and you dont get tired reading my long post.

[nifrek]

RD: R-boosts act that way because rockets are slow and also seem to spawn late, so chances are when you press fire/secondary fire you're already going as fast or faster than the rocket itself, which is why it will always push you forward (the way you are already moving to).

[Mr. Bougo]

How can reducing/removing make the game SLOW?

Rocketjump is pretty recent on public servers... In early 2.3 times, when I joined the game, I saw like noone rocketjumping... Was the game SLOW? No.
And what about bunnyhopping, laserjumping and all this? Is it slow?
And... anyway... Who wants a fast game, who wants 5-minutes rounds, where no teamplay can exist...? Is this like "I have no time to play so hurry up plz, I want to win NOW". It's a GAME, not a competition!

I wanted to vote "reduce" but went wrong and hit "remove", but actually I might prefer "remove", I should test that more...

[divVerent]

Fast paced is all good and fine, but teamplay should still be encouraged and not hindered.

The value 0.2 for the delay makes rocket boosting still possible, but a bit weaker... but it needs good aiming now. OTOH you get more control from it, once used to it (depending on aim direction, you get boosted in different directions), that may even improve the trick a bit (that is, less speed from it, more control)...

[zombie]

Red Dragon pretty much sums it up for me, but I'll add a couple of things.

First, I think most of the complaints about rocket boosting/flying pertain to matches where there are a small percentage of highly skilled players- ie, those who know how to effectively use this technique. It is certainly frustrating (damn near impossible sometimes) to defend the flag against some of you guys! But I'm getting better at it... and slowly, I'm learning to cap flags that way myself.
There's always going to be pros dominating noobs (how often is the top score several times higher than the second top score?).
Also, there are players that have the movement skills (hopping, laser) which noobs can no more defend against than the rocket boosts.
I think it's just a question of technique and skill level. Maybe for that reason, it could be up to voting as a way to handicap much better players. Otherwise I voted for no change.

[Mr. Bougo]

Also, there are players that have the movement skills (hopping, laser) which noobs can no more defend against than the rocket boosts.
I think it's just a question of technique and skill level. Maybe for that reason, it could be up to voting as a way to handicap much better players. Otherwise I voted for no change.

Still, I don't think we want an elitist game...

Also, about handicap, how would you vote that? How do beginners vote? Most of the time, they are the non-voters (hence the new 2.4 voting system to make voting more possible)

[Dokujisan]

In early 2.3 times, when I joined the game, I saw like noone rocketjumping... Was the game SLOW? No.

Exactly. Nexuiz was never slow, even when people weren't rocket-flying. Some have argued that you can't cap on maps like facing worlds if you can't rocket fly. That's just a ridiculous argument. The reason why people don't cap without rocket flying is because they don't rely on teamwork. That's really supposed to be the point of CTF.

You wanna talk impossible? Try to stop red dragon when he's mixing laser jumping + rocket flying. There's just no way to stop him when he does that. You can't nex him or hit him with a rocket because he's moving way too fast. Oh... and you only have 3 seconds to kill him if it's on a map like capture city.

It seems to me that the people who support keeping rocket-flying were the people who use it the most. So the game was "perfect" for them because it gave them a lot more power than the average player.

In comparison....I happen to like and use the RL a lot. However, I'm unhappy that it's a bit too powerful. I would prefer the RL's power and radius get reduced a little bit. That's because I'm more in favor of balancing weapons than wielding power.

If the game isn't balanced (between different techniques and weapons), then it's not as enjoyable for everybody.

Maybe reduce or remove is the answer (with a cvar setting) but definitely not keep.

[C.Brutail]

Imho the more skill needed to make a trickmove (RLBoost), the more you need to learn to PLAY. I've voted for reduce.
Don't remove. This is a feature of Nexuiz. Since 1.0.