Discussing weapons

[tChr]

This is from a weapons discussion on IRC. The points of view is clearly colored by the different skill with the different weapons

<[NSB]tChr> the laser gives 30 damage iirc..
<[NSB]tChr> thats more than the MG..
<phreak__> it's not even a real weapon
<[NSB]tChr> and i _hate_ the sound of it.. I've made my own
<Luna> I've made 20 frag killingsprees with it on publics?
<Luna> I had a period when I gave a shit about playing fair on publics, so I only used the laser on all the maps.
<phreak__> \u guys wanna tell me that the mortar is any les annoying
<phreak__> mortar is the worst weapon in the game
<phreak__> it's too fast, too strong, too everything
<phreak__> way too easy to kill with it
<phreak__> i enjoy a good fight
<phreak__> not a quick death
<Luna> I'd say the mortar is on the same level as the shotgun, and the mg.
<phreak__> wtf
<[NSB]tChr> the moretar is the most annoying thing of all, especially on small maps where you get pushed against the wall and stop :/
<Luna> The RL is a bit below them, mostly because it has limited range and the rockets can be detonated easily.
<Luna> Yeah, the push is a bit ridiculous.
<phreak__> not sure how u categorize the weapons luna
<phreak__> doesnt make sence to me
<phreak__> SG, MG, crylink are same category
<phreak__> the come mortar and RL
<[NSB]tChr> no way.. the MG is very powerful at times.. far more than the SG
<phreak__> bullshit
<[NSB]tChr> the MG is my secondary weapon after the nex in many cases
<[NSB]tChr> the damage pr sec is very high on the MG
<phreak__> 3 shots of the SG is a lot more quick hurting the a minute of MG
<phreak__> well i guess
<[NSB]tChr> not if I'm more than 4 steps away..
<Luna> Nex > Mortar >= MG >= Shotgun > RL > Electro >= Hagar > Crylink > Laser.
<Luna> That's how I categorise them.
<phreak__> i mostly agree with luna
<Luna> Although the RL can be better than the MG and the Shotgun in some situations.
<phreak__> although SG belongs between hager and cry
<phreak__> MG right behind it
<phreak__> RL can be better???
<Luna> I suggest that you fix your aiming.
<phreak__> have u ever seen someone dominate with MG or SG???
<[NSB]tChr> my order would be (with my skill in using them) nex - RL - MG - mortar - electro - crylink - hagar - laser - SG
<Luna> Shotgun can kill a newly spawned player in one attack.
<[NSB]tChr> only at point-blank range
<phreak__> but can u dominate a map with it?
<Luna> Mg deals 32 damage for the first bullet and 16 damage for the following bullets, so it takes about 10 hits to kill a newly spawned player.
<Luna> Yes I can.
<Luna> In the general case a shotgun blast deals about 100 damage if all 3 rounds hit.
<phreak__> i wanna see someone dominate me with the SG
<[NSB]tChr> 10 pellets each shot, 10 dmg pr pellet iirc
<phreak__> i'd really be excited to see this
<[NSB]tChr> phreak.. lets play 09 or something with a MG. you use SG, I use MG and we'll see

[Workaphobia]

Laser: Too powerful and cheap on space maps; should be disabled as a default weapon on them

Shotgun: Secondary only good at close range; moderately lousy weapon

MG: Slightly better than shotgun; deadly in the hands of a skilled player, kind of annoying for me

Electro: Difficult to do combo or to strike with primary fire; in many cases not worth the reload time

Hagar: Good weapon, difficult to aim perfectly

Mortar: Very good weapon, in many cases at least as good as the rocket launcher; wayyy too powerful in the hands of a skilled shooter

Nex: I don't think there's much that needs to be said about this one

RL: Good weapon as it is

Crylink: Utter piece of crap that should be abolished if not erased from our memories and the history of the universe. I feel like my lag increases for this weapon alone, and it's less powerful than the shotgun unless at point blank range. It seems to lose all of its potency when fired at a distance. Also, the secret room in nexdmextra1 is a fun place, but why put a crylink of all things there? Why make it a worthless coward's sanctuary instead of actually putting something useful in there like a rocket launcher or a mega health?:

[ihsan]

CRYLINK: It's a shame that the best looking weapon is lamest. This IMHO weapon needs a complete rethink.
More like a Nailgun? Flamethrower (or plasmathrower)?

[GreEn`mArine]

SHOUTING: LIGHTNING GUN !!!!!!

[Workaphobia]

Yes, I agree, a lighting gun would be significantly cooler than.. well actually ANYTHING would be significantly cooler than the crylink as it is now.

[tChr]

The 1.5 crylinks i far better than the 1.2 one, the ROF is increased a lot and I think the spread is lowered. Actually it quite deadly. Far better than the Shotgun, at least from med distance.

I've heard that Its gonna look way cool in 1.5.1

[Wazat]

I've never had any use for the cryo. Ever. It feels too weak for how hard it is to hit with compared to other weapons. If it functioned more like the UT flak cannon, it could be a serious weapon indeed, but currently I prefer the shotgun. :/

I do really well with the mortar and electro, but their alt-fires are rarely useful to me. I like the rocket launcher a lot, but at close range only unless I'm using laser-guided. ;D

I like the nex, but it's quite hard to hit with and all too often my opponent is too healthy and armored to simply take out with a lucky shot. Lag usually takes care of the rest.

I've always hated the shotgun, both on the giving and receiving end. It's a decent weapon, but it's just not fun to use. When I play with friends I usually set the machinegun as the starting weapon instead.

I like the Hagar but often do better with a mortar. The hagar is nice in that it's rapid-fire and heavy-hitting, making it easy to rack up the damage unless the enemy is really evasive (in which case a large explosion is more helpful).

I think a lightning gun would be a very good replacement -- or alt fire -- for the cryo. I think that as an alternate/secondary fire, it would really complement the primary and give it the versitility it needs to compete.

edit: I should admin I haven't played 1.5 yet, so I should probably try it to see for myself first.

[Toets]

Same old discussion we've had before, so same old answer...

I'd hate to see all weapons changed to have the same use/impact in the end. If that's the case, why not remove all weapons but one?!
Some weapons are ment to be powerfull and others are ment to be utterly crappy, at least that's how I see it.
If you think the shotgun is the most crappy weapon ever and you've got no other weapons left, well then I guess it's time to get the hell out of there and run for another weapon/ammo.
The reason you have crappy weapons (like the crylink in most situations) is to give you some sort of defense while running away to get a good weapon, not to get into the combat of your life. The point being : play with some tactics instead of wanting to charge anybody with any weapon.

A very skillfull player can totaly dominate a map with any kind of weapon, but is that a good reason to change the weapons, just for the few that are that good? If the damage was lowered for most of the weapons and it would take 10 shots to kill someone off, I guess it would be fun for the very advanced players. But does one think a "normal" player can even get 1 frag?

Just my 2 eurocents.

[Workaphobia]

We're not saying all weapons should be made equal; there should be some incentive to get a rocket launcher instead of sticking with your shotgun. But the crylink is a downright awful weapon and is not even that fun to use.

[Urmel]

Wouldn't it be fun to have the Crylink as a numbing/freezing weapon so the victim moves slowlier and slowlier the more You hitt him?

/me thinks to have played a gaem ys ago where such a weapon existed..