Balancing changes, Guided missiles, Weapon balance tests

[pain_fedora6]

i loved kh 2 ! i remember playing with ronan and xeno, playing wacka-wacka and penthouse there! (sigh ...nostalgia mode) and was top fun! i just dont get why ppl dont play it anymore, its a very nice tdm combination mode, with the luck factor strong there, and allows for very very fast hunting, making almost all quite large nexuizz maps compatible with it. dunno what it would take to persuade ppl to give it again another chance. it seems to be currently dead : (

[divVerent]

Actually, the luck factor in KH is very small if you have team mates that know how to play it... it then is almost like a CTF cross capture.

But strategies for it need to be still developed. Until now it only has been played "strategyless".

[FraNcoTirAdoR]

And what about that scoreboard item that i recommended a while ago, that displays your current status in the scoreboard near your name? Like when you press the "attacking" bind on the numpad your status is set into ATT, when you press defending DEF etc, this is a much easier way to organize a team, since you can see who is doing what, so you can send instructions like "XY you see everyone is attacking, stay back in the base with me to defend", you both press the defend bind and there you go, the roles are layed out, and can be dynamically and fast changed throughout the whole game. And its not only working in CTF mode Ohh yeah and for newbies who wouldnt know about this bind it would bu just a --- mark by default when you havent set it.

I was thinking about something like this:

[Samual]

And what about that scoreboard item that i recommended a while ago, that displays your current status in the scoreboard near your name? Like when you press the "attacking" bind on the numpad your status is set into ATT, when you press defending DEF etc, this is a much easier way to organize a team, since you can see who is doing what, so you can send instructions like "XY you see everyone is attacking, stay back in the base with me to defend", you both press the defend bind and there you go, the roles are layed out, and can be dynamically and fast changed throughout the whole game. And its not only working in CTF mode Ohh yeah and for newbies who wouldnt know about this bind it would bu just a --- mark by default when you havent set it.

I was thinking about something like this:

[largeimage]

Well, LordHavoc and I were discussing this earlier actually. Except this wouldn't be shown in the scoreboard in such a way, I don't think it's a good idea to abbreviate this though, as new players wouldn't know what it is (Not that the scoreboard is very understandable to new people anyway.) What we were thinking of is having a small (smaller than normal size) waypoint for each player that depicts his role. Also, roles would be assigned automatically if someone doesn't have one or if someone changes roles (Or at the beginning of a match, etc etc). Your role would be displayed for you *somewhere* on your screen, and this may help teamplay a lot as quite a few people would obey that role imo. Anyway, the idea is hard to implement cleanly, especially for smaller teams. But this is a good idea.

[Flying Steel]

How about this- your role is automatically updated depending on where you are on the map.

If you are near your base, it lists you as defending, if you are near the enemy base it lists you as attacking, if you are between the two it lists you as mid-fielding or such.

If you are carrying the flag, you are listed as a flag carrier.


It maybe should also list your health/armor and arsenal if possible. Some people are snipers, some people are skirmishers, some people are wounded, some people are ready to rush into a fight. If there was room for this information at all, it would of course need to be in short hand. Like hitpoints till dead as opposed to listing someone's health and armor values separately.

Another nice feature for teamplay, that might be alot more work though, is team vision, wherein any enemy, enemy flag or enemy flag carrier that a friendly can see, shows up on every team member's mini-map. So everyone knows where the fight is, and where they are needed.

[TVR]

... But strategies for it need to be still developed. Until now it only has been played "strategyless" ...

Since Keyhunt's inception, Xeno & I have always used the strategy of shifting alliances.

Always target the team with the highest score, be prepared to work with the third team, but also be ready for alliances to shift whenever the scores increases.

[divVerent]

That's not really a strategy, but obvious. I always did that too, or, when the other team (as usual) does not cooperate, when yellow has higher score, running away from red and attacking yellow.

[Samual]

How about this- your role is automatically updated depending on where you are on the map.

If you are near your base, it lists you as defending, if you are near the enemy base it lists you as attacking, if you are between the two it lists you as mid-fielding or such.

If you are carrying the flag, you are listed as a flag carrier.


It maybe should also list your health/armor and arsenal if possible. Some people are snipers, some people are skirmishers, some people are wounded, some people are ready to rush into a fight. If there was room for this information at all, it would of course need to be in short hand. Like hitpoints till dead as opposed to listing someone's health and armor values separately.

Another nice feature for teamplay, that might be alot more work though, is team vision, wherein any enemy, enemy flag or enemy flag carrier that a friendly can see, shows up on every team member's mini-map. So everyone knows where the fight is, and where they are needed.

No, it cannot switch automatically based on location. This would mean teamplay doesn't change at all really.. The whole point of it is to have better teamplay. There would always need to be a good balance for the teams, so changing automatically wouldn't work well. Basically, LordHavoc and I think a good balance would be 30% defending, 50% midfielder, and 20% attacking. Defenders job is to stay at the base at all times... Midfielders job is to kill enemy flag carriers, and "escort" the attacker. Attackers job, of course, is to get the enemy flag.

I do think we could benefit from teammate death notifications though. As in, if a team mate is killed by an enemy, a little icon is spawned where he was to demonstrate that there is danger there. Maybe even have a notification show when a teammate is taking damage/near trouble... Although that's pushing it a little.

[Flying Steel]

No, it cannot switch automatically based on location. This would mean teamplay doesn't change at all really.. The whole point of it is to have better teamplay. There would always need to be a good balance for the teams, so changing automatically wouldn't work well.

I think you are missing the point, you just need to see who is doing what, not who is assigned to what. That way you can tell where you are needed at that moment.

Basically, LordHavoc and I think a good balance would be 30% defending, 50% midfielder, and 20% attacking. Defenders job is to stay at the base at all times... Midfielders job is to kill enemy flag carriers, and "escort" the attacker. Attackers job, of course, is to get the enemy flag.

Sometimes jobs change with the game. I'm normally a midfielder, but if I sense that the enemy defenses have thinned, now I'm an attacker. But then I die and respawn at base, and no one is alive there at the moment, now I'm a defender.

So what I am is whatever I am doing at the moment, not what I was assigned to. This game is just too fast for such a rigid system in alot of cases.

What'd help me independently allocate myself to where I am needed more effectively though, is if I could see where everyone else is at that time, to see the thin spots and then fill them with myself.

I do think we could benefit from teammate death notifications though. As in, if a team mate is killed by an enemy, a little icon is spawned where he was to demonstrate that there is danger there. Maybe even have a notification show when a teammate is taking damage/near trouble... Although that's pushing it a little.

Not at all, they have this in RTS games on the mini-map, just do the same. There's no reason why this'd be a problem if it was made subtle enough to not be a distraction in a larger battle.

What about seeing enemies on the mini-map that you can't see directly but that a teamate can see? Like a team shared line of sight radar system? Such a sense of the larger battlefield might help teamplay alot.

[TVR]

That's not really a strategy

If strategy is interpreted as distinct methods to accomplish one objective, then Keyhunt also meets this requirement.

For example, a simple dropped key requires extensive consideration, you may be providing the two keys to a player waiting in ambush, who may have purposely dropped the key.

Purposely dropping the key also has certain advantages, your location can no longer be determined, but it increases the risk that the winning team's keycarrier will manage to capture because of the consolidation.

You can also wait until 2 parties have worn themselves out, and then finish off the victor and snatch the keys.