Balancing changes, Guided missiles, Weapon balance tests

[ai]

However, either way, such system that give a tag to a player based on his position is really not useful. That's what the minimaps are for, no need to clutter the view more with unnecessary stuff which might not even hold true as mentioned by Francotirador.
It will essentially be the same as minimap and minimaps aren't even used that much. People actually complained that the minimap took too much of their view or was 'in the way'.
Maybe it's a thing you have to get used to, I don't know but that's how they felt.

[Flying Steel]

Speaking of mini-maps cluttering the view, why is it when you hit "M" it puts the mini-map in the middle of the screen, instead of in a corner like it used to? Because the way it is now it blocks both your aim and ironically your navigation.

[Flying Steel]

I have noticed some balance changes on the test server, some better and some worse IMO.

Better:

1) Machinegun reverted to default stats more or less.
2) Hagar reverted to default stats more or less.
3) Fireball debuffed to be better balanced.

Worse:

1) Shotgun very underpowered again. (havoc shotgun stood up better before it felt like)
2) HLAC underpowered do to slow refire.


And then there are the usual havoc weapon balance weak areas that still persist:

1) Rocketlauncher speed too fast. Too powerful and bland- both remote features now useless.
2) Crylink underpowered and bland. Should really be reverted close to default settings.
3) Hagar still useless. Speed too slow to hit remotely accurately.
4) HLAC bland. No real refire now and still no spread growth- the whole idea behind this weapon.
5) Laser damage too low for new health system. Needs a buff.

[TVR]

Basic concept of Havoc mode: If you are not holding down a mouse button, you are missing out.

Problems:

->Shotgun primary & Crylink primary are ridiculously powerful, which makes secondary useless.

->Notice how Shotgun & Crylink share the same problem? It's because they're identical!

->Uzi is spray, spray, spray. Just need to move the reticule over the target occasionally.

->Electro combo is now impossible, secondary electro-balls now explode before there are enough to make the combo worthwhile.

->Electro-ball spam works great, however, because there is no need to trigger with the primary.

->Mortar, Electro, Hagar, & RL projectiles all move at 2000, deal around the same damage, and have the same splash... so incredibly bland.

->RL detonation is useless, ever since splash radius decreased, and arming distance increased.

->RL guidance is useless, ever since speed doubled, and turning acceleration became as touchy as hell.

->Nex & Camping Rifle have the exact same primary, except CR has a secondary that puts other hitscan weapon to shame.

->HLAC is reduced to a version of the Laser that consumes ammo.

No one ever played Pro (Havoc) mode for a very good reason

[divVerent]

Let's say Samual is making a MUCH better balance... but it won't become default.

Samual's currently has only the problem of Hagar and HLAC being too similar, it's otherwise great.

[Samual]

Let's say Samual is making a MUCH better balance... but it won't become default.

Samual's currently has only the problem of Hagar and HLAC being too similar, it's otherwise great.

Yes, and that is now fixed in my latest commit to the config file....

For those who want to try it: Get the latest SVN checkout, then go to the console and run "exec balanceSamual.cfg."

Edit: Or go to my server, mainframe.mcintec.net

[Flying Steel]

Well currently it seems like Havoc/2.6 balancing improves on 2.5.2's balance in only its health system and four weapons:

Laser
Shotgun
Machinegun
Nex

Those four weapons are each more interesting (laser and shotgun) and/or more balanced (shotgun, machinegun and nex).

The problem is that in 2.6 all the rest of the weapons are less balanced and alot more bland and damn painful to try to use:

Grenade Launcher: Crappy version of the rocket launcher. It has better radius damage and falloff for splash spamming, but it just isn't enough versus the RL, to make up for the half damage, longer refire, drooping trajectory, no speed advantage and lack of remote controls (albeit rarely useful now with the RL's speed). Secondary doesn't seem to have much point.

Electro: Crappy version of the rocket launcher. Versus RL- less damage, painfully long refire, same speed, no remote controls. Secondary kind of weird and pointless now.

Crylink: Another shotgun with slightly better range/damage but no hitscan. It should never have had its refire halved.

Hagar: A joke. A no accuracy spam weapon that'll be sure to get you killed in any serious fight. Huge spread (10 times what it was!) and slow ass shots the same speed as half the other weapons (bland).

HLAC: Bland as hell; lost everything that made it special and now fights losing battles against hitscan weapons in ranged fights.

Rocket Launcher: Speed and refire so insane its just a better version of mortar and electro. Remote control and detonation nearly useless do to speed.

Rifle: Secondary has no advantage over primary. Worse damage, worse accuracy, worse ammo consumption.

Fireball: Useless primary. Secondary entirely underpowered.


Suggestions:

Grenade Launcher: Decrease refire- at least make it shoot faster than RL. Make secondary hand grenades with slow refire and no contact-detonation but great damage and radius.

Electro: Increase damage to RL level, increase refire to RL level, give burn radius like fireball has so it delivers some damage just by flying close to you even without impact. Reinvent secondary so that shots stick to whatever they hit (walls, players, etc), have no downward influence from gravity, and slower speed.

Crylink: Give it back its refire.

Hagar: Double speed, halve spread. Decrease damage/refire accordingly.

HLAC: Add a heat-build-up and cool down period so that it only works in bursts. Massively decrease refire and increase spread, remove spread growth. Make it the kind of weapon it was always meant to be.

Rocket Launcher: Decrease speed to 1200-1600, increase refire to 1, adjust damage/radius/edgedamage accordingly.

Rifle: Give secondary somekind of damage benefit over primary at least.

Fireball: Maybe reinvent primary as a flamethrower. Make secondary alot better in at least one or two ways (damage, refire, prefire time, radius, ammo consumption, etc.)

[Sepelio]

Flying Steel's changes sound good to me.

[divVerent]

All of the complaints of Flying Steel were design goals by LordHavoc. I totally hate that many guns are so similar.

[tZork]

The only weapon change i like in 'future' nexuiz is the exploring gl secondary. but it dont belong on the gl, its strong enough already. As a hagar sec perhaps.

Seriously tough, what the heck are these settings supposed to do? (refrain to justify this comment until i see the explanation)