Requesting removal of weapon nr. 8 - Hagar

[MirceaKitsune]

I kept thinking more about this so I thought to post here again rather then make another topic. I agree now that the hagar's primary fire is useful and good so far and should stay unchanged, but as I kept playing I noticed no one uses the alternative fire at all including me who hardly even thought about using it. The reflecting rockets are of no use in most cases from what I seen... they may technically help with hitting someone around cornets but that's impossible even for an expert and the crylink has reflecting shots now either way. I personally believe that at least the alt fire should be changed to something else, so I thought to post in another idea for debate:

I was wondering if the alt fire on the hagar would do better off loading multiple rockets when you hold it down, then releasing them when you let go of the button. Nexuiz currently has no weapon with hold-and-load-then-release firing, so maybe one wouldn't be that bad instead of an unused firing type. When pressing and holding the alt fire, 3, 4, 5 or 6 rockets would be loaded into the weapon after a few seconds (the more you'd hold before you release the many rockets it has time to load), then keep them like that as much as you want. Then, when you see an enemy, you release the alt fire and all the rockets spray forward like a shotgun. Just what the primary fire on the rocket launcher in UT classic does, just that they could stay there until you release the alt fire button (or not if its better they auto-release when it loads the max).

So what do you think about that? Maybe a holding-type firing mode for a weapon in the game cold be very nice. And once again I'm not saying "that's how it must be like" just putting the idea up for debate and questions so yeah, what do you think? I personally would really like to see this weapon doing something more useful that can be used more often into the game...

[take_this_cup_of_poison]

I kept thinking more about this so I thought to post here again rather then make another topic. I agree now that the hagar's primary fire is useful and good so far and should stay unchanged, but as I kept playing I noticed no one uses the alternative fire at all including me who hardly even thought about using it. The reflecting rockets are of no use in most cases from what I seen... they may technically help with hitting someone around cornets but that's impossible even for an expert and the crylink has reflecting shots now either way. I personally believe that at least the alt fire should be changed to something else, so I thought to post in another idea for debate:

I was wondering if the alt fire on the hagar would do better off loading multiple rockets when you hold it down, then releasing them when you let go of the button. Nexuiz currently has no weapon with hold-and-load-then-release firing, so maybe one wouldn't be that bad instead of an unused firing type. When pressing and holding the alt fire, 3, 4, 5 or 6 rockets would be loaded into the weapon after a few seconds (the more you'd hold before you release the many rockets it has time to load), then keep them like that as much as you want. Then, when you see an enemy, you release the alt fire and all the rockets spray forward like a shotgun. Just what the primary fire on the rocket launcher in UT classic does, just that they could stay there until you release the alt fire button (or not if its better they auto-release when it loads the max).

So what do you think about that? Maybe a holding-type firing mode for a weapon in the game cold be very nice. And once again I'm not saying "that's how it must be like" just putting the idea up for debate and questions so yeah, what do you think? I personally would really like to see this weapon doing something more useful that can be used more often into the game...

If they reflected twice they would be more useful. As it stands now, with 1 hagar reflection, unless you are firing into a complete box of a room, the reflection bounces the item 1 more meter and than it hits a wall and blows up.

As it is now, the it's not too useful (though I have used it to destroy people standing behind firing holes in castles)

[OverDriven]

If they reflected twice they would be more useful. As it stands now, with 1 hagar reflection, unless you are firing into a complete box of a room, the reflection bounces the item 1 more meter and than it hits a wall and blows up.

As it is now, the it's not too useful (though I have used it to destroy people standing behind firing holes in castles)

I think you are on the right track, but how about if each projectile from the secondary fire Hagar is assigned a random number of bounces from 1 to 5. Some bounce once, some bounce twice, and so on. This would effectively turn it into a room clearance weapon, spraying the whole room with explosives when shot through a doorway for example.

[Aldius]

I might have an idea!
I agree Hagar is neat for a while, but it is kinda out of place in a close game. I realize that most mods die out after a while, but I think this might be worth trying.

Well I read that some people were gonna do something about a melee attack, but
I think we all agree the average fps melee weapon won't fit into Nexuiz game-play;
Maybe there is some way to fit melee in if we made it special ( lol @ the word 'special' );
I just can't think of it right now though

Well in the meantime I know that I love blasting people away with the weak little laser, except it kinda sucks because its hard to aim just for one stupid push away.

But the flame thrower ideas you guys said (plus me playing halo 3 for the fourth time ever last weekend) inspired me for this new weapon idea:

a 'Gravity Shotgun'

My idea for the Grav Shotgun is that it blows people away very strongly (like a force push effect) with slightly weaker than average damage
The catch is it is short range. I suppose it should only be effectve up to about 2 players' heights for example.

*It should have a very wide shot, so it is hard to miss at all if somebody is in near you in front of you. Maybe even some peripherial range. But only when up close, ya know?

* Maybe it could double as like a 'super' laser-boost for extra high jumping.

* Maybe the secondary fire could be like the default laser in nexuiz ( a long thin range but a much stronger physical push since it is a pick up ) but again a bit less damage just to make it different.

Anyways, In my opinion this would make the slightly awkward melee range battles in Nexuiz much more fun.

Any suggestions? Volunteers? I would get to work on a beta version, but have no clue where to start, I just know basic blender modeling and some weak HTML lol nothing like scripts for Q3-ish stuff tho.

Well my mom said it was a good idea anyways.
She believes in it
Maybe you will too?

[Aldius]

On a smaller and simpler ( but possibly more practical ) note...

I got another idea!
Ok I'm sorry, but once again I was just now inspired both by what some of you guys suggested, and a popular console game. I really feel this one is a must, but feel free to chew me out if you disagree (lol jk)
Lemme c if you get the idea from hints

Megaman

Laser

Charge

Megaman

laser

hold click....

charge....

big shot !!!

full charge

megaman

pacman

Ok ok ok Im jk bout the pacman
But do you get it now?

I think we need to make the starting laser just charge up while you hold down the fire button.
This would definitely add some more dimension to the game, adds a tad more more strategy.
I realize that nexuiz already has some form of strategy other than point and shoot,
but at the same time, first realize that this was employed into a NES game way long ago when video games were still digital mazes with blocky graphics and Japanese midi soundtracks. (Which I still love)

*Maybe it doesnt have to make the laser more harmful, but just give it bigger shot and therefore a bigger collision box to increase hit ratio a bit.

*Or maybe it could stay the same size, and increase in damage. It could just change color or something like that to symbolize some increase in damage.

Most likely the best would be a little of both.

This doesnt have to be some drastic huge elephant-sized ball of energy with a 1-hit-KO damage; I think an almost subtle increase in damage and collision size limited by reasonable maximum charge would satisfy everybody's strategy cravings while keeping game balance intact.

Again I think a charging laser would be a nice simple addition that could be kept without harming the balance of the game, while making it a bit more fun for when you run out of freakin rockets. lol

Once again... any volunteers?

[divVerent]

It would make laser jumps work totally different... so most people will hate it.

[Aldius]

It would make laser jumps work totally different... so most people will hate it.

What? why? They could use the laser jump just the same.
All it would do is give you an opportunity to charge if you want.
Once again, like the megaman laser, only charges if you hold it down.
I still think it would add a lot to the game without harming it.

[[-z-]]

Lets pretend I'm a baker who makes famous cookies. Chocolate chip are the most renowned but my other cookies are just as good... in their respective flavor areas, You've become my apprentice and before you even learn how or why I bake the cookies the way I do, you try applying your kraft earned baking knowledge to my recipes. Removing the salt from the oatmeal raisin and replacing it with more sugar because ~you think~ the cookies need to be sweeter without first considering why I, the baker have crafted the recipe as such.

As the baker, I would respect the apprentice who learned my practice before trying to alter it based on preconceptions brought with them from previous baking experience. I'm not saying they shouldn't use their skills earned from other experiences but rather learn to understand my 'culture' before trying to impose their believes unto me. A demand and a discussion are two different things.

The apprentice: "I understand what you're going for with the salt but I think they need a little more sweetness. Can we try adding sugar?"
The baker: "Well, I see where you're going with the sugar, but I think that sort of sweet is a little too cold, we need something that'll give that oatmeal warmth. How does brown sugar with a dash of cinnamon sound?"
The apprentice: "Wow, that sounds tasty, I'd say it's worth a shot!"

The cookies have a very delicate balance.

[Aldius]

So... ehh where's the cream filling? J/k

Um well I didn't exactly remove any salt from your cookies just yet, Mr. Baker.
Those are your cookies after all.

Its more like I asked all of the baker friends I know what it would be like to try implementing a certain spice in a new cookie that I personally did enjoy growing up. I wanted to know what those cooks thought about it.

When the Baker master found out about this idea, he found it upsetting that the new apprentice thought that he knew better about cookie recipes than he did.

After all, his cookies are world famous.

[[-z-]]

Under what credentials did the apprentice deliver this suggestion to the baker?

I think a charging laser would be a nice simple addition that could be kept without harming the balance of the game.

This shows me you didn't take the time to learn and understand the recipe. This claim is a false and under-informed opinion.

The laser is the staple of movement in the game. Many maps cater to specific laser jumps (see flag carrier thread about 70% reduction breaking some maps). Timing, force and damage will drastically affect gameplay as we know it.

This is why the apprentice must understand why the famous cookies have salt before adding too much sugar to ~balance them out~. We can be left with little dough in the ratio and sugar isn't what makes these cookies famous.

It is balance. Something an experienced baker knows better than the apprentice.