rag doll physics

[tundramagi]

its sending what drawn to the video card, i.e. the models, maps, and bitmaps. the qc and models would be in the next releases dataxxx.pk3 file.

It is converting the .md3 into it's own internal format, and sending the triangles to the card.

Read md3 -> convert to internal format -> convert into triangles the vidcard can understand.

This can be changed to (when a laser cuts a model, or a string of bullets rip through an arm):
Read md3 -> convert to internal format -> convert into triangles the vidcard can understand -> time passes -> bad things happen to model -> add/subtract triangles from interal model, split it into 2 or more internal models, throw them around (or one of them), etc.... they're just triangles, we can do this.

The md3 is just a starting point, the engine can do whatever it wants with the triangles in memory.

[MirceaKitsune]

Since I modeled a few characters for Nexuiz in Blender, I see the character skeletal problem like this: DP only knows to 'bend' models by their animations (every .zym model has its own verticles bones and animation sets, and DP shows a certain model while that model plays a triggered animation from itself). Imo what DP needs to know is how to animate bones dynamically as an offset over the normal animations, and how to rotate and offset bones or verticles via code.

If DP could do this it would allow more nice stuff apart from ragdoll physics. A very important possibility would be for players to be seen leaning back / forward when the player aims up or down. Another nice thing would be stuff like flexible models or brushes (flags, goo, etc) which could move when you touch them or go through them

Just an observation and idea - Water in DP already knows to animate verticles from code. If you go in Slimepit Revisited for instance and look at the slime, the entire water surface is wavery. So maybe code from there could be reused on the bones of player models to make them move as wanted.

[Mizu Kitsune]

i can make the water splash with qc, but then lots of code to make things splash differently.

[tundramagi]

i can make the water splash with qc, but then lots of code to make things splash differently.

That would be cool, nexuiz doesn't have any of that yet.

Also would the cutting model in memory that we talked about above be possible (I would think it would be as you can do what you want with triangles once in memory.) That way we could even have the lazer grids which are found in some maps... cut the victims up properly .
(Hell, with that you could make a sci-fi horror movie completely in DP/Nexuiz).

[Mizu Kitsune]

i know it is possible with md3 because you can set the variables in mesh.qc, not sure about .zym but defs.qc effects.qc and either misc.qc or something like ragdoll.qc need to be done first.

[tundramagi]

i know it is possible with md3 because you can set the variables in mesh.qc, not sure about .zym but defs.qc effects.qc and either misc.qc or something like ragdoll.qc need to be done first.

For cutting models (deleting current model, then spawning 2 (or more) models that are the generated-by-darkplaces divided models of whatever was cut (division being to the nearest vertex in a vertex loop) divverent said that work would also need to be done on the model caching code (I guess to deal with generated in memory models).

That is the same area where automatic LOD could be added (known as decimation in 3d modeling programs IIRC (basically your merging some close vertexes, reducing the count of the triangles thusly).

[tZork]

Nut sure if what your talking abt is segmented models, if so you could cut the mesh in X pieces and attach them by bones (dpm, zym) or tags (md3). The wired part would be to get normal animation to work then (algorithmic? reference skelly?). Also, it would need to be client side to not rape bandwidth.

The sane way would of course be to handle it by extending the engine so expose bone control to quakec, add multianimns and so on. but there seem to be noone willing or able to do this atm.

[Mizu Kitsune]

Nut sure if what your talking abt is segmented models, if so you could cut the mesh in X pieces and attach them by bones (dpm, zym) or tags (md3). The wired part would be to get normal animation to work then (algorithmic? reference skelly?). Also, it would need to be client side to not rape bandwidth.

The sane way would of course be to handle it by extending the engine so expose bone control to quakec, add multianimns and so on. but there seem to be noone willing or able to do this atm.

segmented models, yes. dpm?

[tundramagi]

Nut sure if what your talking abt is segmented models, if so you could cut the mesh in X pieces and attach them by bones (dpm, zym) or tags (md3). The wired part would be to get normal animation to work then (algorithmic? reference skelly?). Also, it would need to be client side to not rape bandwidth.

The sane way would of course be to handle it by extending the engine so expose bone control to quakec, add multianimns and so on. but there seem to be noone willing or able to do this atm.

Not talking about segmented models per-se. We'd never get everyone to make those. I'm talking about DP segmenting the models in memory along the nearest vertex string when say a laser rips through someone. This is, ofcourse, possible as dp can do whatever it wants with the triangles in memory. Div says the model caching code is where most of the work needs to be done (that would include sending the clients the new in-memory data to draw the newly generated models I would think (send them the vertex and uvmap info for the pieces). For choosing where to chopup the model the ring-loop algo can be used from blender.

In OSS, one needs to program around artwork limitations , but really that's usually the best way as it reduces the burden on content creators. Also it makes things "just work" as one doesn't need to be using a supported model (as all would support it thusly).

[Mizu Kitsune]

i said i would segment the models. so far the only thing i can get to do with models is just animate regularly them and change the textures, besides bounce and slide in static dead position.