New CTF scoring system

[Dokujisan]

This is an off-shoot from another thread.
http://forums.alientrap.local/viewtopic.ph ... sc&start=0

I think this should be a new topic of discussion. I'd like to hear everyone's input.

To summarize, there are some of us who think the current scoring system for CTF "pays" the attacking players far more than players that defend the base or the flag carrier. The scoring system does not encourage teamwork at all.

The current system pretty much encourages everybody to run toward the enemy base to grab the flag, while ignoring your teammates. At the end of a game, the scores will show one player with 125 points because they were the "runner", while the other players did not get any extra points for helping them run with the flag. I believe that teamwork should be reflected in the scores.

Here is what I propose...

Extra points scored....

- if your teammate grabs the enemy flag, and you are within a certain radius of them, then you get 2 extra points. This is interpreted as you helping them grab the flag.

- If you kill an enemy player that is within a certain radius of your flag carrier, then you get 2 extra points. This is interpreted as you defending your flag carrier.

Note: the ENEMY that you killed has to be within a radius of the flag carrier. You could be far away, sniping enemies and protecting your flag carrier.

- If you kill an enemy player within a certain radius of your flag when it is at your base, then you get an extra 2 points. This is interpreted as you defending the flag at your base.

- If you kill an enemy player within a certain radius of your base while the flag is gone, then you get an extra 1 point. This is interpreted as you defending the base while the flag was gone.

The game already does calculations based on radius for explosive weapons, so it seems like it would not be too hard to use radius to award points for teamwork. This radius system does work on some assumptions, but I believe they are safe assumptions that would be accurate in most cases.

This system would reward people for attacking in groups, defending the flag carrier, defending the flag, and protecting the base. Anything outside of these scenarios would just be treated as DM.

Please state your feedback and input on this.

[charlesk]

I realize some of these might be hard to implement, but I think they'd be great.

BTW not sure if you saw my reply in the other thread, but even without these changes, just setting the points for returning the flag at half that of scoring (instead of a quarter) helps a lot. --c

[RoKenn]

To summarize, there are some of us who think the current scoring system for CTF "pays" the attacking players far more than players that defend the base or the flag carrier. The scoring system does not encourage teamwork at all.

Please state your feedback and input on this.

Well, defending the base can be quite profitable .

I defend very often, and mostly defending is easier than attacking, so that the attackers are very low on score and we defenders are very high. I even had a game when my team was only defending and won easily.

Yet your scoring system sounds promising. But one more thought: shooting the enemy flag carrier gives one point, returning the flag 5 points. Very often A frags the enemy fc, B returns the flag. Maybe it would be fairer to distribute the score 3/3, so that fragging the enemy fc is more rewarded.

(But I appreciate it, when - as already happened - the flag falls onto my head )

Finally: IMHO the individual score is just a rough estimate how useful someone is for the team. Don't overrate it.

(Maybe showing the individual score should be removed entirely...?)

[Dokujisan]

Finally: IMHO the individual score is just a rough estimate how useful someone is for the team. Don't overrate it.

(Maybe showing the individual score should be removed entirely...?)

Well, that is exactly what it is. It is feedback to the user and that is the reason why people should not underrate it.
The personal score is basically a message to the player telling them which behavior is most valuable. Many people may think it doesn't really matter, but I think it actually does influence game play quite a bit.

Concerning the returned flag points, I agree. It makes more sense to balance that out more.
Perhaps
+1 for kill and +1 for killing flag carrier
+2 points for returning the flag.

So if you were defending your own base and the enemy ran in and grabbed the flag, but you killed them instantly and returned the flag, that would be...

+1 for the kill
+1 for defending base
+1 points for killing enemy flag carrier
+2 points for returning flag

5 points

In the same scenario, if you killed the enemy flag carrier and then your teammate returned the flag, then you would get...

+1 for the kill
+1 for defending base
+1 points for killing enemy flag carrier

Your teammate would get
+2 points for returning flag


Let's think of more scenarios to help iron this thing out.
More ideas and feedback please.

[RoKenn]

Well, that is exactly what it is. It is feedback to the user and that is the reason why people should not underrate it.

You mean I should think about why I'm very often the top scorer... of the loosing team...?


Your suggestions sound fair. Maybe one more issue: if you shoot the enemy fc into space it only gives one point. Maybe this also should be rewarded better?

[Calmatory]

Well, personally, I believe that best system would be that one who successfully scores, gains 15-30 points. Every kill gives one point, logic.

Anyway, in public servers you can not really expect much of a teamplay anyway, thus changing scoring system in order to try to improve teamwork is, IMO, pointless.

Also, in clan matches, it is pointless to care about individual player's score, but the score of the team.

[Dokujisan]

I believe that best system would be that one who successfully scores, gains 15-30 points. Every kill gives one point, logic.

You mean the current system, right?

Well, in many cases, multiple players cause the flag to be captured, not just the one carrying the flag. However, recognition of that effort, the success of the flag capture, is only given to the one carrying the flag.

That scoring leads many people, such as you, to think of the flag carrier as the "successful" one, when that just is not accurate.

Also, in clan matches, it is pointless to care about individual player's score, but the score of the team.

Then why are there personal scores at all?

My answer: it is to let players know how they are doing. It is to give credit to players for their role in capturing the flag. If they played a role in getting the flag captured, then the personal scores should show that. That, IMO, is what they are there for.

If the personal scoring is setup properly, that will influence people to focus more on team play. Players will learn to start following their flag carrier, because they get extra points for protecting the flag carrier.

[Dokujisan]

You mean I should think about why I'm very often the top scorer... of the loosing team...?

With my suggested personal scoring, you will know which teammates are not playing as a team.

[Dokujisan]

Not to suggest that my proposal is finalized in any way. I really want some feedback and suggestions for this concept. We should run it through some scenarios to see if the scoring makes sense.

Like when you shoot the enemy flag carrier off into space. You should get
+1 for the kill
+1 for killing the flag carrier
+2 for returning the flag

I'm not sure how that could be "defined" programmatically, but that is the ideal result for that scenario.

[torus]

- if your teammate grabs the enemy flag, and you are within a certain radius of them, then you get 2 extra points. This is interpreted as you helping them grab the flag.

Sounds good, as long as it is limited to 1 person. That way, a team can't just go in a massive party and rack up points.