avirox wrote: To be perfectly honest, and this coming from a north american, I think people here would rather play a game with more new elements than a rebirth with some small changes (as is what pro seems to be at the moment). I once suggested in the alientrap channel a kind of expansion pack, featuring some new weapons and game modes (like a class-based game mode even, similar to Team:Nexuiz). It's just a suggestion, but it may seem more appealing to those who already have a bad impression of the game.

that's exactly what I think... put the tricks in and put nexuiz exclusive stuff.

on a side note, if we were to split pro and regular, regular would look like a tricycle, and pro would look like a dirtbike, so which one is the newb gunna download? I don't think regular nexuiz should be the "training wheels" of the FPS.

avirox wrote: When nexuiz 1.0 was first released to the public there were tons of NA servers and players but they soon dwindled due to the horrid performance and the even-worse netcode.

Exactly..Theres the problem from the start.

and now still, annoyingly bad lagging (although when i have a lot of programs closed it doesnt seem to be as...bad) i see the clock in-game more then i see my opponents!

ok perhaps not, but there is a serious problem here

Yup the number 1 problem with Nexuiz is performance. Even if the developers hate to agree
I think the mappers should optimize all the maps for 2.5 or 3.0 or Pro. And the pogrammers optimize the QC code (maybe just strip unnecesary gamemodes and mutators).
And LH optimize the engine, but I think he already thinks its optimized enough. And maybe it is... it is a Q1 engine after all... and the content is very high def...

I have not had any big problems with the netcode sofar... I can play on german servers pretty smooth, it was much worse before. For ME that is.

The QC code is the thing that does NOT need optimization - a server never eats more than 10% CPU here. I do agree it isn't exactly efficiently written, but it's still being the smallest part of what costs CPU time. The only thing in the QC that is too slow is the bot initialization code (the waypoint linking) - but I would need the eleven foot pole to touch that (it isn't even using arrays because it was originally written for a QC compiler that does not know arrays, that's why the code looks so copypastey).

divVerent wrote:The QC code is the thing that does NOT need optimization - a server never eats more than 10% CPU here. I do agree it isn't exactly efficiently written, but it's still being the smallest part of what costs CPU time. The only thing in the QC that is too slow is the bot initialization code (the waypoint linking) - but I would need the elven foot pole to touch that (it isn't even using arrays because it was originally written for a QC compiler that does not know arrays, that's why the code looks so copypastey).

yeah I'm running a server on a pentium 3 and the only problem is my internet connection

The main thing that sucks with nexuiz is performance. It's not even THAT pretty and it needs a monster to run because of the useless lightning (at least to me, i really don't give a flying shit about this, it only hinders visibility) and way too high polycount. That's the main thing that stops me from playing it, i tought 2.2 would be better, but even with ALL the settings put to lowest and picmip to the maximum, it's barely playable, so i said, fuck it, ill just play quake 3. If you want this game to be popular, this needs MUCH improvement. I could post the link to a nexuiz download on a populated message board, chances are most replies will be "my pc isn't good enough".

Otherwise it's a fine game and all, maybe needs some tweaking but nothing too big. I see the worst part has already been changed (retarded nexgun strenght). I understand that it's a free game and thus, you don't owe the people who download it anything, but if your goals is for nexuiz to be popular, this would be a step in the right direction. Hell, if nexuiz becomes popular you could be making money.

TVG wrote:The main thing that sucks with nexuiz is performance. It's not even THAT pretty and it needs a monster to run because of the useless lightning (at least to me, i really don't give a flying shit about this, it only hinders visibility) and way too high polycount. That's the main thing that stops me from playing it, i tought 2.2 would be better, but even with ALL the settings put to lowest and picmip to the maximum, it's barely playable, so i said, fuck it, ill just play quake 3. If you want this game to be popular, this needs MUCH improvement. I could post the link to a nexuiz download on a populated message board, chances are most replies will be "my pc isn't good enough".

I can run the game fine even on high settings with at least 60fps, on low settings it goes up to more than 300fps! And I really don't use a monster (P4 3GHz, 1Gig RAM, Geforce 7600GT). Performance problems appear on custom maps though, no wonder if you ask me. On standard maps a 2 Ghz machine with a 3 years old midrange VGA should be enough. I just don't know where the problem is.

What imo confuses many newbies is the outstanding (unique??) movement physics what many players misunderstand as a performance problem. The only problems I do have is what GreEn`mArine already pointed out: high sensibility concerning non-optimal internet connections.
I've been participating more or less active helping to solve the people's performance problems here on teh forums, many of them wonder why the game doesnt run properly with their prehistoric Geforce2 or onboard VGA, but most of them do have problems with the inet connection. Once you ask them if they have the same problems playing locally, it comes out they havent even tried...

I currently have WinXP sp2, 1.5 Ram, P4 3.4 GHz with an old like hell socket (478) and GeForce 4 Ti 4800 SE.. it runs very good on low and even with medium settings. High settings lags but not that much as it won't be playable, at least I still win most of the times with high settings too.

Urmel... wrote:What imo confuses many newbies is the outstanding (unique??) movement physics what many players misunderstand as a performance problem. The only problems I do have is what GreEn`mArine already pointed out: high sensibility concerning non-optimal internet connections.
I've been participating more or less active helping to solve the people's performance problems here on teh forums, many of them wonder why the game doesnt run properly with their prehistoric Geforce2 or onboard VGA, but most of them do have problems with the inet connection. Once you ask them if they have the same problems playing locally, it comes out they havent even tried...

1. I have an old geforce 2 and the only thing that can play is quake 2, and mabie 3.

2. I have DSL, and that works pretty well too, even with german servers. The problem is people see this as a free game and don't expect enough from it or don't take it seriously. I guess putting a "pro" version out would fix that, but it's still not right somehow.

psychiccyberfreak wrote:
1. I have an old geforce 2 ...

This is quite familiar in the US as it seems. Here in europe nobody seriously would use that for gaming. This is 6 years old technology, an IT methusalem. And I really dont understand why ppl have VGAs like that in a > 2Ghz computer, you could have so much more for just 50 bucks...

This is quite familiar in the US as it seems. Here in europe nobody seriously would use that for gaming. This is 6 years old technology, an IT methusalem. And I really dont understand why ppl have VGAs like that in a > 2Ghz computer, you could have so much more for just 50 bucks...

yeah but I also have a new geforce 7600 too.

again no one has really replied to the guys comment, i see this all the time.

and now it's going off topic again.


'It works fine here on my set-up i have a monster pc e.t.c talk'

there is a serious performance problem and TVG is correct, until something drastic is done about it you won't see increases in players, but it just seems to be over-looked all the time, i mean this is not the first time someone has mentioned about the problem, and i always see the same comments after, why not actually look into the problem more in-depth for once...and think about possible solutions? instead ofthe usual posting specs about how good your computers are.

Let's scrap this idea, and just make a new thread called "ideas to attract more people"

Honestly, that's what nexuiz pro is supposed to do, right? I'll do that now.

k0jak, I see your point, but there's a big probem with this, wich was written down a trillion of times, but what the hell, I'll write it down again: most modellers, 3D artists are somehow freak out from the 3 letters of GPL. I've seen a guy (sorry I can't remember your name now ) who1s working on new models for Nexuiz. but he's the only one (beside tZork, but he makes stuff ocassionaly, and afaik don't have interest in player models).

So the main problem: there's noone to make them.

Soooo much stuff to read..

Let's scrap this idea, and just make a new thread called "ideas to attract more people"
Honestly, that's what nexuiz pro is supposed to do, right? I'll do that now.

Well yes and no.. Nexuiz Pro should attract people but i think those are other people then those that already like the normal Nexuiz. A lot of people miss strafejumps and walljumps but i think Nexuiz is perfect without them. Nexuiz Pro could give those people those things. Just read some of the release annoucements on esr. Some just dislike games without strafe jumps and think every game has to have those..

there is a serious performance problem and TVG is correct, until something drastic is done about it you won't see increases in players

Well MOST of the maps run good enough and i'm not totally sure anymore that playermodels really will help that much. Thats because i expected the new health/armor items already to boost fps but benchmarks did not change a bit. But probably playermodels will indeed help a bit.
On the other hand i can run Nexuiz MUCH better then Quake4. Is that really such a serious problem as you make it?
And of course others already told that its not that easy to get new models. And i kinda feel like not being in the position to tell that those that tried to get modelers did something wrong. I have neither a clue about modeling nor about what to tell those people so i have not tried. Thus i can't tell if those that tried did something wrong. Savage for example tried but was not very successful. I just hope that situation will improve in the future.
Also:

I currently have WinXP sp2, 1.5 Ram, P4 3.4 GHz with an old like hell socket (478) and GeForce 4 Ti 4800 SE.. it runs very good on low and even with medium settings. High settings lags but not that much as it won't be playable, at least I still win most of the times with high settings too.

Seems Nexuiz is good enough but maybe performance settings need to be more accessible. The current solution with 'exec low.cfg' is not that good.

The main thing that sucks with nexuiz is performance. It's not even THAT pretty and it needs a monster to run because of the useless lightning (at least to me, i really don't give a flying shit about this, it only hinders visibility) and way too high polycount. That's the main thing that stops me from playing it, i tought 2.2 would be better, but even with ALL the settings put to lowest and picmip to the maximum, it's barely playable, so i said, fuck it, ill just play quake 3. If you want this game to be popular, this needs MUCH improvement. I could post the link to a nexuiz download on a populated message board, chances are most replies will be "my pc isn't good enough".

I still doubt that setting everything to the lowest does not run good enough for online play. I played Nex on more then just one computer and it runs quite ok when tweaked. If real time lights look good or not is a personal preference but its good to show a bit eye candy for starters. I for example like it for eyecandy but then i really enable everything.

http://esteel.planetnexuiz.de/nexuiz/screenshots/nexuiz000643.jpg
http://esteel.planetnexuiz.de/nexuiz/screenshots/nexuiz000598.jpg

Well LordHavoc was told about the lag and prediction problems. Most of he net problems seem to be false predictions so maybe this will improve.

I agree with lots of the stuff Greenmarine was written:

- a better demo-code .. be able to create server demos (multiview demos), let demos play more fluently
- make spectating more fluently
- a better hud with more information (CSQC)
- G A M E P A S S W O R D ! ! ! ONEELEVEN
- Nexgun zoom to be clientside, not serverside
- simple items
- (colored) fullbrightskins to be done clientside. not serverside
- LOD for the playermodels
- player statistic intermission at the end of the map
- a graphical voting system for the maps or other settings
- a graphical server admin interface

But that stuff should not be only for the Pro version. In fact those should be additions for 3.0. Lots of the stuff however requires CSQC which still is not perfectly usable.

"What I would propose is to introduce such "progaming"-related things step by step and not so many at once as mentioned on the page.

If you want to make the game more "pro", and end up handing even more advantages to experienced players, I think you really run the risk of losing up-and-coming players at even worse rates than at present

Okay, I see the problem with calling it 'Nexuiz Pro'.

The origin of this idea is based on this 'serenity' project announced; there is a demand for that conventional competitive style of game play. And while I like Nexuiz how it is, I think that some small modifications to the main game could cater to this audience. But, there is the problem of having two downloads, or splitting up the community, and the confusion of calling it 'Nexuiz Pro'

So what I think needs to be done is, it needs to be a separate download with a new name. New weapons, new movement and game play style, and it would use some of the maps/textures/item from Nexuiz (with some changes when needed for speed, visibility, etc).

Yes, I like that idea, as long as those are the ONLY changes. I'd also add in a voice system. I would use different models for everything, though. Lastly, someone should make a graphical frontend for servers (with multiple server support?), or at least improve on the one built into the game (example has no support for custom maps... excuse me if that's wrong), because lan parties are popular, and you definantly want it to be easy to setup a server.