mand1nga wrote:

Chubby wrote:Heh, now an other wep model for the nex? I would still use the 2.3 model because I can't aim with the 2.4 model.

Try using the crosshair instead of the model for aiming, its far better

Awesome.

Alpha:

http://morfar.planetnexuiz.de/WeaponData/

Yeah, shotgun can do 180 dmg in theory but this almost never happens in practice (watch my video).

mand1nga wrote:

Chubby wrote:Heh, now an other wep model for the nex? I would still use the 2.3 model because I can't aim with the 2.4 model.

Try using the crosshair instead of the model for aiming, its far better

That's my problem. With the 2.4 model, look at the crosshair, but still can't aim. With the 2.3 model, I look at the crosshair too, and I can aim.


Maybe I should post a little vid about it.

Chubby wrote:

mand1nga wrote:

Chubby wrote:Heh, now an other wep model for the nex? I would still use the 2.3 model because I can't aim with the 2.4 model.

Try using the crosshair instead of the model for aiming, its far better

That's my problem. With the 2.4 model, look at the crosshair, but still can't aim. With the 2.3 model, I look at the crosshair too, and I can aim.


Maybe I should post a little vid about it.

Do you really understand that weapon model has no relation? I could name rl as nex model and still have the same thing (nex).

Alien wrote:Public non password protected system means shit in stats cause each xsax can take your name and do nonsense.

Well. We not can has any auth in nexuiz as of now, but hopefully we will get there someday. And on a large scale, fakenicking is not a big problem. Yeah xsax gets your name and ruins 1-5 games... so what lol, the impact is very minor. plus he'll get bored much soon.

Alien wrote:Agree, FB skins should be on, but THEY ARE NOT REQUIRED IN GOOD MAPS ( you can use floodfill to fill your map with light and all colours except several (GREY) are bright).
So the sole reason why gameplay sucks is because most maps sucks (saying this 100th time).

sure sure
but the real situation goes like this
we've got ALOTTA DARK MAPS
would be much more simple and convenient to turn on fbskin than to remake maps.

Alien wrote:

Chubby wrote:

mand1nga wrote:

Chubby wrote:Heh, now an other wep model for the nex? I would still use the 2.3 model because I can't aim with the 2.4 model.

Try using the crosshair instead of the model for aiming, its far better

That's my problem. With the 2.4 model, look at the crosshair, but still can't aim. With the 2.3 model, I look at the crosshair too, and I can aim.


Maybe I should post a little vid about it.

Do you really understand that weapon model has no relation? I could name rl as nex model and still have the same thing (nex).

You don't understand I see........


The 2.4 model is a problem for ME.

Alien wrote:Do you really understand that weapon model has no relation? I could name rl as nex model and still have the same thing (nex).

It actually has. Not the "game-mechanics-wise" but psychologically-wise.
For example I can aim much much better, and even hit unrealistic shots when am playing without sound.

But you've got to be quite pro to understand this...

alpha wrote:

Alien wrote:Do you really understand that weapon model has no relation? I could name rl as nex model and still have the same thing (nex).

It actually has. Not the "game-mechanics-wise" but psychologically-wise.
For example I can aim much much better, and even hit unrealistic shots when am playing without sound.

But you've got to be quite pro to understand this...

Exactly

It the same thing as saying that in arcade fighting colour of controlled characted means smth. Execution, execution and another execution means much more. Same goes for nex model (unless it is too distracting for you, that's another thing). But I don't think that the current model is distracting (at least not for me).

I personally find it silly to blame faults on the model. It's the same silly thing as in q3 cpma blaming poor shaft performance due to the width of beam.

Alien wrote:It the same thing as saying that in arcade fighting colour of controlled characted means smth.

warm

Alien wrote:unless it is too distracting for you, that's another thing

hot

Alien wrote:I personally find it silly to blame faults on the model. It's the same silly thing as in q3 cpma blaming poor shaft performance due to the width of beam.

Wrong. You were really close, try moar.

Everything matters. And I repeat: you've got to be quite pro to understand this.

You seem to be most pro here, or what?

Alien wrote:You seem to be most pro here, or what?

Thanks

That was irony. I usually take comments from person who claim to be pro and know everything with a pinch of salt.

Alien wrote:That was irony. I usually take comments from person who claim to be pro and know everything with a pinch of salt.

Suit yourself.

I dont like playing with the sound off, but it does make you concentrate more on the visual aspect of the game to find your targets rather than trying to hear where they are. I think this may be what Alpha is getting at.

On that note, I hit unrealistic shots anyway

@alpha:
First of.. well, could you explain it to us who aren't "pro" please, oh almighty alpha?
By the way, I have never said anything about fullbright stuff. I don't care if things are fullbright or not, I also haven't seen anyone complaining about this either (till just now that you seem to do it). Anyway, I'm not gonna voice my opinion about the fullbrights as I don't really care at all which way.
However, one thing I am going to say is that of course on public FFA servers, fullbright should be off. What's the point in choosing a player model then?

Anyway, to my main point. Nothing in the post I made had any personal attacks or anything to do with you really. But it seems that you really want to cripple all hitscan weapons that can actually deal some heavy damage to you. What picture those that give out do you think?
I don't also care if you're being owned by MG and Nex, I don't even care if you're good with them. But one thing is clear that everyone agrees on, except you apparently. It's that, do NOT change the weapons to fit BAD maps. Change the MAPS to fit the game.
I don't care if GW, FC etc. are the nr.1 favorite maps on the servers, the gameplay STILL sucks. Of course MG and Nex will have a devastating effect on open shot-right-into-the-enemys-base-from-your-own maps.
Maps where you can easily spawnfrag people from your own base are BAD maps. There's nothing else to it.

@Alien:
The shotgun isn't supposed to be all powerful as it is a starting weapon. And honestly, comparing this starting weapon with other games this shotgun is the best. In most games you can hardly frag anyone with that. But the shotty you can kill a freshly spawned player no sweat if you aim good enough and you're close enough (with the sec fire mode of course).
The primary is good for longer range. I often see people to the exact opposite, shot sec when enemy is far away and primary when enemy hugs them, this is very wrong.
I even encounted Kojn do that

ai wrote:I don't also care if you're being owned by MG and Nex, I don't even care if you're good with them. But one thing is clear that everyone agrees on, except you apparently. It's that, do NOT change the weapons to fit BAD maps. Change the MAPS to fit the game.
I don't care if GW, FC etc. are the nr.1 favorite maps on the servers, the gameplay STILL sucks. Of course MG and Nex will have a devastating effect on open shot-right-into-the-enemys-base-from-your-own maps.
Maps where you can easily spawnfrag people from your own base are BAD maps. There's nothing else to it.


The primary is good for longer range. I often see people to the exact opposite, shot sec when enemy is far away and primary when enemy hugs them, this is very wrong.
I even encounted Kojn do that

ai is completely right just because a map is popular doesn't mean it is good for gameplay. There is nothing wrong with the weapons so much, as for maps that are designed badly that encourage the use of the most powerful weapon/s.

MG is powerful but when used correctly and in the right situation perhaps it may be too strong at times it may seem but it's normally when someone with a great aim uses it, and thats not the weapons fault i guess.

Mappers are making more technical and better maps now with better gameplay, if you want to fix the problems start playing better maps, if you want to have some fun then play other maps it's as simple as that.


Actually i use primary now most of the time but your probably right ai, i love you


and, isn't this going off-topic now quite a bit? this thread seems to have gone on long enough now.

ai wrote:@alpha:
First of.. well, could you explain it to us who aren't "pro" please, oh almighty alpha?

you don't get it you aren't one. Simple as that.

ai wrote:@alpha:
I don't care if GW, FC etc. are the nr.1 favorite maps on the servers.

then why would we care? There are more FW/GW lovers than all of you aww-bad-maps-whiners combined.

kojak wrote:just because a map is popular doesn't mean it is good for gameplay.

lolololololololololololololololololololololol LOL. FAIL. just because YOU say that? LOLOLOLO

kojak wrote:There is nothing wrong with the weapons so much

says the king of nex whores

Yeah, seriously, VERY unbiased opinion

Alpha. One time, Eggandbacon (a map) was popular like crazy. But seriously, do you think it has good gameplay?
You act like you are a god alpha, and you look down on anyone that doesn't even compare to 'your' standards (which frankly is about 98% of the Nexuiz community). I don't take your opinions seriously because of that.

But enough about that. I'm with Kojn, this topic is getting out of hand. Let's get back at it's roots or it might as well end up locked:
Does the Nex need nerfing, Yes or No?
ai: No

ai: no
alpha: yes

next one pick up the whole list and continue

Sepelio wrote:I dont like playing with the sound off, but it does make you concentrate more on the visual aspect of the game to find your targets rather than trying to hear where they are. I think this may be what Alpha is getting at.

On that note, I hit unrealistic shots anyway

Your choice, but you can't hear people then.

ai wrote:@Alien:
The shotgun isn't supposed to be all powerful as it is a starting weapon. And honestly, comparing this starting weapon with other games this shotgun is the best. In most games you can hardly frag anyone with that. But the shotty you can kill a freshly spawned player no sweat if you aim good enough and you're close enough (with the sec fire mode of course).
The primary is good for longer range. I often see people to the exact opposite, shot sec when enemy is far away and primary when enemy hugs them, this is very wrong.
I even encounted Kojn do that

So make laser only as primary weapon. It's nonsense that good old shotgun should be made stupid because it's primary weapon. 3 shot mode, ffs. Yeah, good against noobs who are standing in the corner. Lame against everything else. The thing is that people prefer nex in close combat over sg and this is bad. Like you would fight with sniper rifle in real life.

alpha wrote:

Alien wrote:That was irony. I usually take comments from person who claim to be pro and know everything with a pinch of salt.

Suit yourself.

I never claimed being a "pro" anyway.


ai: no
alpha: yes
alien:
nex - 70 dmg, 0.7 s reload
sniper - 200 dmg, 3 s reload
shotgun - 140 dmg for sec fire, same reload, one shot, higher spread

I like Alien's solution, except for the 200 damage part. 200 damage is way too high for a sniper. Since we have headshot detection, 200 could be for a headshot, and something more reasonable for a bodyshot.

torus wrote:I like Alien's solution, except for the 200 damage part. 200 damage is way too high for a sniper. Since we have headshot detection, 200 could be for a headshot, and something more reasonable for a bodyshot.

yeah, exactly. but 3 secs reload is rather high. 140 dmg for body shot and 200 for headshot then.

Perhaps. We would really have to see how it works in game though.

I think your damage values for the Nex are ideal though- basically turning it into a shock-rifle type hitscan weapon.

To balance the new sniper however, it would REALLY need to be placed with care, and sparingly. We can't have every player and his mother running around with a sniper rifle.

You both give too much shit about irrelevant stuff.

Reload time is unimportant. What matters is the amount of damage that could be dealt withing a certain exposure period (time to aim and land 1 shot). Some people have it 1-2 seconds like me, I know pros that have around 0.5 seconds.

No point really in nerfing nex if we get another gun that deals 140 damage per exposure.

alpha wrote:No point really in nerfing nex if we get another gun that deals 140 damage per exposure.

So you're basically saying that there should not exist a weapon that does 140 or more damage in the entire game? If that's true, then nerfing Nex has the absolute wrong reasons and should not even be considered to nerf at all.
That's just one personal opinion that really hasn't anything to do with the whole gameplay and weapon balance.
It's like saying: Don't buy those cookies!
And you ask why and he answers: Cause they are too salty. Add more sugar!
That is a total personal (even biased) opinion that has nothing to do how good the cookies are to anyone else.

Oh and, do not nerf the Nex, just create another weapon which can do 70 or whatever damage. Nex can be the current sniper rifle. I'm really against nerfing Nex, but not against adding another 70 damage weapon (which basically is the same thing only different label.) I'm not against increasing the damage to Nex (or adding longer refire rate to it for that matter).

ai wrote:

alpha wrote:No point really in nerfing nex if we get another gun that deals 140 damage per exposure.

So you're basically saying that there should not exist a weapon that does 140 or more damage in the entire game? If that's true, then nerfing Nex has the absolute wrong reasons and should not even be considered to nerf at all.
That's just one personal opinion that really hasn't anything to do with the whole gameplay and weapon balance.
It's like saying: Don't buy those cookies!
And you ask why and he answers: Cause they are too salty. Add more sugar!
That is a total personal (even biased) opinion that has nothing to do how good the cookies are to anyone else.

Plenty empty words w/o proof or logical basis. Just personal attacks and accusations...

blah blah blah

anyway, noobs aside, the vote goes on:

Do we ask devs to nerf nex from 140 dmg to 70?

for otherr votes make yourself a thread ( or I will do if this vote succeeds )

alpha:yes
ai:no

You ruin voting = you are faggot.

No Nex should NOT be nerfed, already talked about it 100 times, Nex is fine as it is, it can be dodged, bit of luck and a lot of prediction is all that's needed.

GW/Face both suck and are the most popular maps because new players and some mediocre players just fail in a technical map, therefore they keep things simple straight paths to bases no walls to use splash on and easy camping/shooting from a very safe distance, it's the exact same reason Mentalspace and Cbctf1 are popular on 6v6 matches, even tough they were probably never meant for more than 2v2/3v3 and each and every game on them is absolute fail because of the insane number of players, low weapon availability and the lack of walls. And since we are at walls removing damage through walls will just make games way better, as you can actually use stuff for cover, not just twelve feet thick reinforced concrete walls, and will make all games less spamy in all game modes.

PS: Adding a shock rifle would be nice only and only if it had the shock core combo
PS2: http://forums.alientrap.local/viewtopic.php?p=45926#45926

alpha:yes
ai:no
alphagod:no

Lool, looks like alpha is contradicting himself now or is consciously trying to sabotage Nexuiz with his bad ideas.
However alpha, you still haven't answered my question, and in fact, it is you who attack me. I have never attacked you, I just spoke the truth.
Here's the question I want answered by you: "So you're basically saying that there should not exist a weapon that does 140 or more damage in the entire game?"

alphagod wrote:PS2: http://forums.alientrap.local/viewtopic.php?p=45926#45926

ai wrote:Lool, looks like alpha is contradicting himself now or is consciously trying to sabotage Nexuiz with his bad ideas.
However alpha, you still haven't answered my question, and in fact, it is you who attack me. I have never attacked you, I just spoke the truth.
Here's the question I want answered by you: "So you're basically saying that there should not exist a weapon that does 140 or more damage in the entire game?"

Actually, yes (to prevent spam killing). Or in the worst case have very high reload time.

Komier: Yes, nex should be made weaker. Already another sniper for high damage+long range, nex could be more multi-purpose.

BTW: When I play it's probably close to 70% audio 30% visual. I like prediction.

Also, pro just means you play for money. >.> "professional" That makes me good because I used to have $5 bets on games with my friends when I was a newbie?