Before the 2.5 series, the Grapple Hook had no "ammo" limitation and was "offhand", meaning it was not a device you had to switch to in order to use, but could be fired separately at anytime, regardless of what weapon you were currently wielding. This all made the grapple hook an interesting and dynamic gameplay feature, but it also created such severe imbalances by making players so mobile, that it was only available to be turned on as a Mutator (it was off by default).

Now in the 2.5 series, the Grapple Hook is becoming an integrated part of the game, thanks to the added limitations of having become a pickup weapon that consumes energy cell ammo. This is certainly an improvement, as the GH is an interesting aspect of the game and deserves to be integrated in a balanced way.

But the exact implementation of this feature could be better. There isn't any reason why energy cell ammo should be the limitation for a mobility feature, there's nothing about the crylink, electro, nex and HLAC that makes them more dangerous when combined with GH mobility that should make them more effective than the ballistic or explosive type weapons. And as such, maps with energy pickups balanced for energy weapon usage have the unintentional side effect of fueling GH mobility.

I believe the most logical and simply and fun solution is to make the Mutator Grapple Hook consume Jetpack fuel. This is the most logical because both are about mobility, not firepower, and both add a similar kind of mobility to a similar extent. This is the most simply solution, because it doesn't complicate map balancing by mixing up ammo limitations with the already diverse energy weapons. And it is the most fun, because Jetpack fuel regenerates on its own, so that it is an integrated part of your native mobility options, while not being so unlimited and powerful that you have to use it all the time to be competitive (assuming the Mutator is active for that server).

Then, in the future, when and if the Jetpack becomes integrated into the non-Mutated game with its own separate fuel pickups, the Grappling Hook can use these as well, instead of the energy ammo.

Hook secondary is a weapon that does actual damage, thus cells.

Only way to make the "hooking" use fuel would be always showing both ammo counters when hook is selected... not sure if I'd like that.

Well, I committed that now. It can be taken back if it is bad.

Hooking = 15 fuel
first two seconds of pull are free
then 8 fuel per second pull

Well, I committed that now. It can be taken back if it is bad.

Hooking = 15 fuel
first two seconds of pull are free
then 8 fuel per second pull

Wow, thanks!

DivVerent wrote:

Flying Steel wrote:Then, in the future, when and if the Jetpack becomes integrated into the non-Mutated game with its own separate fuel pickups, the Grappling Hook can use these as well, instead of the energy ammo.

Hook secondary is a weapon that does actual damage, thus cells.

True, but of all the weapons in the game, the gravity bomb might be the least only one that is unused/underpowered, so if it consumed 50 fuel and/or had a long reload time between shots, it probably wouldn't be at all too powerful; it'd probably be no more effective than the laser (the other ammo-less weapon).

Hook should use no fuel as it always did. Where is that option?

Alien wrote:Hook should use no fuel as it always did. Where is that option?

Just curious, have you tried using the Grapple Hook Mutator along with any of the "Arena" Mutators? Because when you combine them, for some reason, you get the old offhand grapple hook that consumes no energy or fuel.

I meant isn't this poll for what hook should use by default if enabled?

This can't be coded as an option. It either has to take one or the other.

This will probably break morfarctf. If I can add unlimited fuel it's fine though.

g_grappling_hook 1 also enables fuel regeneration, so it should be fine.

Alien wrote:I meant isn't this poll for what hook should use by default if enabled?

The poll was about whether the offhand mutator-enabled grapple hook should use fuel by default or continue to use energy as it currently does. Partly because:

morfar wrote:If I can add unlimited fuel it's fine though.

Is an adjacent issue/solution. Now that the Grapple Hook uses Jetpack Fuel, an Unlimited Fuel Mutator/Command would get you back the old unlimited GH option that you want. And I can imagine the ability to turn on an unlimited Jetpack outside of a weapon arena mutator could be desirable as well, and would come with such an option automatically.

Looks like in 2.5.1, the JP Fuel regeneration is directly linked to the health amount and regeneration setting in whatever gametype/mutator you are using. For instance, fuel doesn't regenerate at all in LMS or Instagib because health doesn't regenerate in those gametypes. I would imagine fuel will be unlinked from health eventually though anyway, so it probably won't be an issue for a would-be unlimited fuel option at some point.

Fixed that regeneration bug.

Regeneration is not the same as using no fuel at all (that is Q1 hook).

You can always set a cvar so it uses no fuel.

divVerent wrote:Fixed that regeneration bug.

Thanks again.

divVerent wrote:You can always set a cvar so it uses no fuel.

It's great then.