Mizu Kitsune wrote:yea, that's true, and i doubt they would be up for it.

I think DivVerent implied he wouldn't mind, since it'd just be a cosmetic change.

this is how i feel things are starting to go, especially with "The Community" wanting to incorporate sp as well as other elements of gameplay, i.e. flashlight, weapons, etc, and the dev's shooting them down, is that groups are going to set up there own svn with nexuiz but coded with what they want so in time there will be at least 3 different nexuiz svn's.

Going by some of the recent talk that is certainly possible. You could have a classic fork, tactical/rpg fork and then the new default nexuiz (which aims to be somewhere in between perhaps, with 2.6 balancing).

What I personally would prefer to see though is for Nexuiz to just be a general purpose engine (with more features than plain darkplaces) with all these popular mods and mutators shipping with it. Because with the limited development resources available, it might be better to combine efforts, unless goals are really just too different to be combined at any level.

such coding of an rpg system would'nt be to hard, nor consuming, putting all together and making content will. Quake1&2 had an inventory system much like that of half-life and other games today where your weapons, and if you hacked it, the keys, runes, and health+armor, followed you to the next level, but in nexuiz that code is gone. it wouldn't be at all hard to reincorporate that code, but problem is still the level loading splash screen with the console opening and player position wouldn't be saved like in hl and similar. I find that rpg system to be, in my opinion, a great idea, one that has failed us in the past, but can be pulled off, if not with nexuiz then maybe with its own engine not derived from dp.

My other two hobby projects are action/rpgs, so I'm certainly a believer of the potential of such cross-genre games, if executed correctly. Methinks the ultimate game would be an action/rts/rpg even.

Yes, like Samir Duran and Kane, or as you've said, your list of characters. a character that creates wonder in the player and opens up the universe.

Well as far as I'm concerned its not a matter of whether or not to have such characters, but how many.

ai wrote:

Flying Steel wrote:or kane from command and conquer

That's actually spot on. I never thought of Kane that way but now that I think about it, I suppose he is just as mysterious as Gman. As he doesn't age and stuff (not talking about clones). However, Gman is an alien though, that's for sure. Who has taken on human for (hence why he talks so damn weird).

Well there's actually alot of alien activity in the C&C universe as well, starting with Tiberium in Tiberian Dawn and then the crashed Scrin UFO in Tiberian Sun and Westwood (now mostly Petroglyph) said there was going to be a Scrin invasion in Tiberian Twilight/Dusk, as I understand. And Kane's Brotherhood of Nod first came to be / became powerful on the Tiberium processing technologies it pioneered.

So there is the possibility something is the case with him. (And certainly the case with Duran).

Flying Steel wrote:I think DivVerent implied he wouldn't mind, since it'd just be a cosmetic change.

then it all comes down to lordhavoc and the rest of the team.

Going by some of the recent talk that is certainly possible. You could have a classic fork, tactical/rpg fork and then the new default nexuiz (which aims to be somewhere in between perhaps, with 2.6 balancing).

What I personally would prefer to see though is for Nexuiz to just be a general purpose engine (with more features than plain darkplaces) with all these popular mods and mutators shipping with it. Because with the limited development resources available, it might be better to combine efforts, unless goals are really just too different to be combined at any level.

agreed. after all dp is just a rendering engine with minimal physics and game code. and nexuiz is the qc game code.

My other two hobby projects are action/rpgs, so I'm certainly a believer of the potential of such cross-genre games, if executed correctly. Methinks the ultimate game would be an action/rts/rpg even.

same here, however i aim to make roleplay shooters where there is no plot until one is made up by the people, there is a generally plot, but each person has full control over their actions witch can ultimately change the entire storyline for all 1k+ people on the master server.

Well as far as I'm concerned its not a matter of whether or not to have such characters, but how many.

i'd say just keep one in mind for the time being.

ai wrote:

Flying Steel wrote:or kane from command and conquer

That's actually spot on. I never thought of Kane that way but now that I think about it, I suppose he is just as mysterious as Gman. As he doesn't age and stuff (not talking about clones). However, Gman is an alien though, that's for sure. Who has taken on human for (hence why he talks so damn weird).

Well there's actually alot of alien activity in the C&C universe as well, starting with Tiberium in Tiberian Dawn and then the crashed Scrin UFO in Tiberian Sun and Westwood (now mostly Petroglyph) said there was going to be a Scrin invasion in Tiberian Twilight/Dusk, as I understand. And Kane's Brotherhood of Nod first came to be / became powerful on the Tiberium processing technologies it pioneered.

So there is the possibility something is the case with him. (And certainly the case with Duran).[/quote]

It is possible.

Mizu Kitsune wrote:have you tried to noclip and kill him, bullets just bounce off and the crowbar makes the metal sound on him

I have noclipped and both shot and crowbared him. Bullets don't bounce off him, they go right through and the crowbar doesn't make any sound at all (like any other friendly character you try to crowbar).
However, basing information off of noclipping isn't accurate at all. It's basically just a prop which you shouldn't be able to get to anyway.
What he is or isn't is based of the actual story, not the props in the game mechanics.

ai wrote:

Mizu Kitsune wrote:have you tried to noclip and kill him, bullets just bounce off and the crowbar makes the metal sound on him

I have noclipped and both shot and crowbared him. Bullets don't bounce off him, they go right through and the crowbar doesn't make any sound at all (like any other friendly character you try to crowbar).
However, basing information off of noclipping isn't accurate at all. It's basically just a prop which you shouldn't be able to get to anyway.
What he is or isn't is based of the actual story, not the props in the game mechanics.

true, but it still is unclear what he is and he appears in every installment just the same.
when i tried to kill him, i nocliped above and in front of him, then turned off noclip and landed before him, then tried to kill him. but i think we are going off topic, we were talking about a storyline for nex before we ended up with gman. lol ^_^

Hey! I'd like to joint this project.\!

So first:

I can do interior/exterior/props design, may help with dialogs, voice acting (i love it!), eye candy and ear candy as well (music and sound fx). I'am (more or less) familiar with: Ubuntu, Blender 2.49, Gimp, Inkscape, Ardour, Audacity and LMMS.

And twice: I think to organise the work and reach our goals of this project we need:

→ internet site (forum?) dedicated to the project (for developers not customers) for better work organisation

→ list of things to do with dead/WIP/completed status (or something) and people who contribute/contributed to this particular thing.
Theese to-do's would be everything: story, characters, models, sounds, music, levels, scripts, textures etc...

→ list of all people willing to help the project: nick | e-mail | what-can-do for easy searching people you need for particular element of production process

→ list of project leaders - people who knows what the project is aiming for and will decide what is to be done and how it should look in the end.
Democracy doesn't look like a good thing here. It leads to chaos and in the end nothing is done,
beacuse no one agreed what is to be done. You already noticed this in the thread. Certianly leaders should listen to other people's ideas,
but should have their own strong vision. Otherwise even if the project is done - it will be a chaotic frankenstein of
all different type of ideas with no main colour behind it. Some mixing of ideas is good, but one should be a dominant to set in some order.
Won't you agree with me, guys?

Let's take it that way:

IS THIS PROJECT STILL ALIVE?

It is in a coma.

My interest in working on this has waned since the character class project ran out of steam and no coders have picked it back up.

Because in my opinion, character classes are essential to making an interesting campaign. Fighting enemies that are simply copies of yourself over and over and over is just lame. Same thing with fighting hordes of weak "monsters" or "minions" over and over and over.

Call me stupid, call me whatever, but there's just 2 points that I'll never understood (at least until someone explains them to me ):
1 why for the damned reason, coders when they converted old quake code to the nexuiz code, they didn't just leave the simgle player code that there already was in quakec?You know what I'm talking about: monsters, monsters, monsters(from zombie to big creatures like the Shambler one -GOOOOD- ).
2 why use a complex skeleton system like zym and don't try to insert ragdoll/real phisycs system?

Of course, point 1 still remains one of my biggest interrogatives!

Infact, If I were a coder (unfortunately I'm not!) I could see there's a weak monster ai code, I could be able to rearrange it, and I could change a part of it or the whole script and recreat a Shambler (that, for Copyright reasons, it should be named in other manner!) blood thirsty, which is able to search, hear, hide and sorround players with other monsters!

Of, course, as I said, call me stupid if this is a nonsense reply!

toneddu2000 wrote:1 why for the damned reason, coders when they converted old quake code to the nexuiz code, they didn't just leave the simgle player code that there already was in quakec?

I don't know for sure, but I don't believe Nexuiz was ever based on Quake game code. The game code wasn't even GPL-licensed by id Software, from what I know. The only connection between Nexuiz and Quake is DarkPlaces, which is the low-level engine that runs the game code and handles input, graphics and networking.

So we need some system to manage oppnents (monsters)? And control their AI so every single type/one behaves diffrently?

unfa wrote:So we need some system to manage oppnents (monsters)? And control their AI so every single type/one behaves diffrently?

We'd need code that allows you to have much greater control over opponent spawning, and to spawn opponents that have different "stats". Like opponents that run fast and shoot machine guns, or are slow but strong and use rocket launchers, etc.
Then you need story telling features, which are only minimally supported at present.

In short though, this project would need dedicated help from at least one coder good with C (to make the necessary features happen).

What about a fund raising campaign? If the whole community participates we could obtain at least some money to support a month salary for a developer(wherever he/she is).

I very much doubt that would work / be enough.

A qualified someone would need to have the motivation to volunteer their time and expertise.

Flying Steel wrote:A qualified someone would need to have the motivation to volunteer their time and expertise

Okay, but, don't you think that a little earning could be a nice motivation?
If you think that all of us(of the Nexuiz Community) we have to find every little spare time in our work/stufy life to invent, test, create..If someone, with those code skills, earning a little money, could take a lot of benefits to this community (and to the Open source world in general), I would be very grateful to this guy/girl, and I didn't dislike to make a donation, as other maybe 100/1000/10000 guys around the world!
Don't you think it could be reasonable to make a test (with a forum thread for example)?
Sorry for my rusty english tonight but I'm too tired!

Apart from fund raising campaign...

Maybe we could take a while and plan what we will exactyl need. Taking your thougts into account, Flying Steel:

- different types of hostile creatures spawning with different behavior, armory and capabilities (like moving speed, ability to dodge, track, wait hidden, stay silent and attack from behind for example). Also think about some automatic defense cannons - they only aim at player and shoot different stuff, maybe just with some movement prediction. Stationary active defence devices I mean.
- tools for in-game dialogs - recorded vocal artist's work with something like subtitles and even...
- ...facial animation for speaking and just game-engine-based cut-scenes (facial morph - emotions)? (holy shit!)
- engine for cut-scenes (is there anything in Dark places already for that?) - you know: making bots (enemies) do some sequencial things like: go somewhere, talk to each other, push some switches, take a look at a screen, take a look around, sniff the trouble and so on... this also requires sequencial camera control and other stuff like that
- tools for interactive in-game music (maybe based on patterns?), depending on what is happening to player
- also stuff that deals with saving/loading games (and it should be possible in every moment of game - like in Unreal and Quake - does Dark Places support that?)
- transporting player from one level to another (is this all about spawning the player and giving him all the stuff he had before, setting his health and armor level?) - maybe it will be good to make levels intersect a litlle bit with each other, so starting next level brings you just where you've finished the previous one?

These are some random ideas of what we'd need. Anyone else has a Google account? We could start creating internet documents to write down with detail things like this.

PS:

One more thing - do anybody know how about exporting skeletal animations from Blender? Is it donable? And is this easy? We might need a lot of character animation - I thik that it is currently the weakest point of Nexuiz. And to increase realism and quality of game ilusion - we need good animated creatures. I'am playing with character animation on my own by now using Blender Game Engine.

- different types of hostile creatures spawning with different behavior, armory and capabilities (like moving speed, ability to dodge, track, wait hidden, stay silent and attack from behind for example). Also think about some automatic defense cannons - they only aim at player and shoot different stuff, maybe just with some movement prediction. Stationary active defence devices I mean.
This is possible. There are already defense guns in the game. The easiest way to do this would probably be simply to have the player on one "team" and the enemy ai on the other.

- tools for in-game dialogs - recorded vocal artist's work with something like subtitles and even...
An interactive tutorial exists I think... somewhere

- ...facial animation for speaking and just game-engine-based cut-scenes (facial morph - emotions)? (holy shit!)
- engine for cut-scenes (is there anything in Dark places already for that?) - you know: making bots (enemies) do some sequencial things like: go somewhere, talk to each other, push some switches, take a look at a screen, take a look around, sniff the trouble and so on... this also requires sequencial camera control and other stuff like that
Bots can be scripted to do things, look at some of the videos for the tuba

- tools for interactive in-game music (maybe based on patterns?), depending on what is happening to player
Probably possible. Currently you can have entities tied to music.

- also stuff that deals with saving/loading games (and it should be possible in every moment of game - like in Unreal and Quake - does Dark Places support that?)
Not a clue

- transporting player from one level to another (is this all about spawning the player and giving him all the stuff he had before, setting his health and armor level?) - maybe it will be good to make levels intersect a litlle bit with each other, so starting next level brings you just where you've finished the previous one?
I know theres new features in that let maps trigger things like this ie map changes from an entity on the map

Just a suggestion: put all the specifications in a document, or maybe a wiki that can be edited online.

It would be good to have a world where the player can walk througt and have some missions in the world and for the others take spaceships.
maps are quite tooooo small!!!

so the user could:
- do missions in the town (and earn money for buying new better weapons)
- have missions in space stations
- have missions on other planets
- have missions in spaceships

what we need:
- modelers for the many, many things in the town
- developers for the programming
- time

...and it would be funny to have vehicles (small spaceships) which the user could drive and buy and pieces of artillery (bigger guns!!!).

If you like the idea (town)
please post a comment fast!!!

It may be easier to get a singleplayer into the new project, Xonotic:

http://www.xonotic.org/

This seems to me like a good idea - if Nexuiz is going to be left, let's go with our community and support the Nexuiz-ascending Xonotic with our singleplayer campaign!

I already made a post on Xonotic Forums!