Offering my services - Modeler/Texturer

Post anything to do with editing Nexuiz here. Whether its problems you've had, questions, or if you just want to show off your work.

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Tue Sep 22, 2009 2:50 pm

  • Quality work Oblivion, and the winking emoticon monitor is a nice touch. :D

    ai wrote:We should not even try to keep current animations, but in fact, create new ones. Player based if needed (which will end up like that eventually I believe).


    I think player based is the way to go for most player models anyway. I mean there's no point in making different playermodels if they aren't different. :wink:

    toneddu2000 wrote:Great model Oblivion and, moreover, great metal texture! I'd like to have your talent!


    With practice, you could make similar metal texture jobs by using a combination of a diffuse and a specular texture.

    Notice that on the model the areas around the edges and corners and other areas where the surface looks like it has been scratched and scuffed are brighter and shinier. Those are areas that are brighter on the specular map but darker on the diffuse map and represent where fresh, uncorroded and unpainted metal has been exposed.

    The areas that are less shiny are brighter on the diffuse map but darker on the specular map and represent areas that have more paint or have been corroded over with metal oxides.
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Tue Sep 22, 2009 5:07 pm

  • Flying Steel wrote:With practice, you could make similar metal texture jobs by using a combination of a diffuse and a specular texture.

    Notice that on the model the areas around the edges and corners and other areas where the surface looks like it has been scratched and scuffed are brighter and shinier. Those are areas that are brighter on the specular map but darker on the diffuse map and represent where fresh, uncorroded and unpainted metal has been exposed.

    The areas that are less shiny are brighter on the diffuse map but darker on the specular map and represent areas that have more paint or have been corroded over with metal oxides.

    Thanks Flying Steel! I'm trying to follow your precious hint and if I have success I'll try to finish the percival vehicle that I've put in the garbage some months ago! :D
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    toneddu2000
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Tue Sep 22, 2009 5:55 pm

  • toneddu2000 wrote:Thanks Flying Steel! I'm trying to follow your precious hint and if I have success I'll try to finish the percival vehicle that I've put in the garbage some months ago! :D


    Cool. :)

    Keep me posted on your progress (maybe on another thread though so we don't derail Oblivion's topic here).
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Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:13 pm

Fri Sep 25, 2009 2:47 am

  • Thanks guys. And yep, exactly as Flying Steel said.

    The diffuse texture for this is actually quite drab. The metal effect is almost purely the result of a good specularity map.

    Most new texturers try to cram everything into the diffuse map, as far as actually making almost all of the textures from photos. That's not quite the way you do it and the results are often quite bad. Metal textures don't exactly look like metal if you attempt to purely use a phototexture.

    Most game models now have multiple maps that work together, not just one (although I have no idea which are supported by nexuiz currently). It's important to make them correspond, like the edge of a panel in the bump map should fit the edge of the panel in the diffuse map and the spec map, the shadows of the diffuse map should correspond with how high they are in the bump map, etc. (hence why working with a masterfile is highly recommended rather than doing each map separately). I'll try to outline them here and give samples from this model (Note that these are still not finished maps, but can already show you the basics of how they actually work in concert. I resized them for this thread. Also once I finish I will provide a PSD file to show you the basic workflow):

    Diffuse/Color Map - this is what people usually refer to when they say texture. As the name implies it's simply the color you put in the faces of the mesh. And by color I don't mean monochrome, but fullblown textures. Like the wood grain photo you might put on a tree mesh, or a picture of a leaf you might put over an alphad mesh of a leaf.

    Image

    Luma/Glow/Self-Illumination Map - Determines which areas of the mesh remain continuously lighted no matter if it's hidden in shadow. The values are simple: Black means it's affected by dynamic lighting etc. and will not glow in full shadow, the lighter it is the more it will 'glow'. White = glows, Black = does not glow. It's important that it corresponds with the diffuse map too, since it illuminates any area no matter if it's just metal. So placing a patch of white on a glow map where it is actually just metal in the diffuse map would result in a weird always visible patch of metal on your final model (although that will also be useful to show diffuse lighting, like a continuously illuminated sign under several lights).

    Image

    Bump/Height Map - Determines raised/recessed parts of the model. White = raised, black = depressed, and all values of gray in between. Bump maps are usually quite smooth in metal (no pitting unless it's organic), with sharp edges unless you want it to have rounded corners. Bump maps however are a bit limited in comparison to normal maps, but you can convert bump maps to normal maps with certain plugins and apps easily enough.

    Image

    Normal Map version of the above Bump map (a bit more complex to explain than bump maps so I won't try ;D it works on a similar concept to bump maps except that it relies on how light bounces off a specific area in the face):

    Image

    Specularity Level Map - Determines what areas are shinier (i.e. turn white when illuminated directly). The combination of spec and diffuse often is what makes something recognizable metal or glass or rubber. Hence you can make a fully black diffuse map for a box, use pure white for specularity and end up with a glassy cube. Or you can use a gray diffuse map for a box, and use a speckled, streaked, rusted etc. specularity map that are a bit more worn around the edges and up with a metal box. Or you could paint the box black for diffuse and use an almost black spec map and end up with a rubber box. etc.

    Image

    Anyway, le progress:

    Image

    Still have to refine the textures further and add masks for 'shirt/pants' color. A word of warning: I know nothing about animating. At all, not even setting up bones and whatnot. :oops: So I'll have to leave that part up to you guys. As for the 'horse legs' I thought one of the nexuiz models already had horse legs. :?
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    Oblivion
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:27 am

Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:29 am

  • Amazing work, oblivion. Thank you for your texturing talent and contribution!
    <Community>: Why was the name "Nexuiz" licensed to IllFonic in a way that allows IllFonic to use the name without any suffix or subtitle for a commercial console game?
    <Lee Vermeulen>:
    <Community>: http://www.xonotic.org
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    halogene
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 9:04 am

  • Thanks a lot Oblivion to share your knowledge with us. I've only a question, can you please explain how to set 3d scene for lighting tests? Because, every time I started to learn shaders and materials (and I gave up :x ) the first obstacle that stays in front is lighting rig. If I set a spot light from the left with a 1.5 intensity, reddish colour, with linear decay, and an other fill light with blueish 1.2 from the left, is different from a rig composed by three point lights with all specular turned on with no decay. And so on. Can you please give some advices?

    PS:But, why use bump and normal maps with same pattern? It wouldn't better to use a bump map with scratchies, bullet holes, signs that prove the oldness of that material, and normal to add detail to geometry(beveling, fine detailed circuits, etc, just like you did)? It's just a question, not a critic? :D
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 10:43 am

  • This thread is made of pwnz0r! I love the weapons in the first post - very pr0 stuff there Oblivion!

    Liking Rad's tiger-based model too - I'm thinking "mutant-cyborg-weretiger" as in large claws, digitigrade legs and a load of metal bits.
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 11:14 am

  • Oh wow, that's very nice Oblivion! :O
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    FruitieX
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 2:41 pm

  • You are correct Oblivion, the carni and armored carni models have digitigrade legs.


    toneddu2000 wrote:PS:But, why use bump and normal maps with same pattern? It wouldn't better to use a bump map with scratchies, bullet holes, signs that prove the oldness of that material, and normal to add detail to geometry(beveling, fine detailed circuits, etc, just like you did)? It's just a question, not a critic? :D


    If I may answer this, you don't actually use the bump map on the model once you have baked its details into the normal map (well, except maybe with parrallax mapping, but that's another story). The thing is it isn't really humanly possible to draw a normal map by hand, so you draw details you want to hand draw into a grayscale bump map and then have software convert it into a normal map for you.

    So the the bump map goes into creating the normal map, along with any details baked into the normal map going from a high poly model to the lower poly in-game model.
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 2:53 pm

  • ihsan wrote:Good modeling technique but those horse hind legs won't match the standard skeleton :(

    Neither does Carni, but he has a different skeleton/anim set to compensate for this.
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 3:10 pm

  • thanks Flying Steel for your reply, but I meant another thing
    If I may answer this, you don't actually use the bump map on the model once you have baked its details into the normal map (well, except maybe with parrallax mapping, but that's another story).

    this was my point
    The thing is it isn't really humanly possible to draw a normal map by hand, so you draw details you want to hand draw into a grayscale bump map and then have software convert it into a normal map for you.

    yes, of course, maybe I've structured wrong the question. I try to re-define it! :D
    There's two ways to generate a normal map, baking an high poly model to a low poly model(maybe using internal renderer or the fantastic Dernormgen by Dragengine, or using a grey scale image converted by a plug in for the major 2d apps. My question was: once we have our nice normal map created with one of the two method above, why don't use a grey scale bump map to add scratches, imperfections, oldness signs, and so on ? I've seen this tecnique in Doom 3, it's not my idea! :D
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    toneddu2000
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 3:27 pm

  • toneddu2000 wrote:yes, of course, maybe I've structured wrong the question. I try to re-define it! :D
    There's two ways to generate a normal map, baking an high poly model to a low poly model(maybe using internal renderer or the fantastic Dernormgen by Dragengine, or using a grey scale image converted by a plug in for the major 2d apps. My question was: once we have our nice normal map created with one of the two method above,


    One thing- you don't have to use just one of the two methods, you can combine them both into one normal map. So the bump map, like the high poly model, you just use to create the normal map but it isn't used in game because it isn't needed (its information is now in the normal map).

    I don't think Oblivion meant you should use the bump map in-game, if player model normal maps are supported in Nexuiz (which I'm sure they are or would be if someone made some of them).

    But don't throw away the high poly model or bump map of course, they are your source files and you or anyone else could really use them some day if you/they want to make future adjustments to the textures.

    why don't use a grey scale bump map to add scratches, imperfections, oldness signs, and so on ? I've seen this tecnique in Doom 3, it's not my idea! :D


    I think Doom 3 might have been using parallax mapping, which combines a gray scale bump map with a normal map to create a supposedly more 3D look, where the bumps are warped to create a perspective effect. I don't know if darkplaces supports this technique, at the moment, but IMO it isn't that great looking anyway and I have heard it uses alot of resources.
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Fri Sep 25, 2009 4:29 pm

  • I don't think Oblivion meant you should use the bump map in-game, if player model normal maps are supported in Nexuiz (which I'm sure they are or would be if someone made some of them).

    ok, understood, thanks!
    I think Doom 3 might have been using parallax mapping, which combines a gray scale bump map with a normal map to create a supposedly more 3D look, where the bumps are warped to create a perspective effect. I don't know if darkplaces supports this technique, at the moment, but IMO it isn't that great looking anyway and I have heard it uses alot of resources.

    I don't know if this effect is cpu/gpu-consuming, but, trust me, it's a very good visual effect! Because you've the normal, with polished fine details and then you use a bump map almost black/grey for subtle details (like a stain) in a bright grey, only to emphasize that detail!
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    toneddu2000
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Sat Sep 26, 2009 10:29 am

Sat Sep 26, 2009 1:31 pm

  • Ok finished! :D

    Someone please grab the files and save them where they won't disappear. Releasing this under GPL blah blah blah, so do whatever you guys want to do with it. :)

    Meshfiles (max, obj, and 3ds):
    http://www.mediafire.com/?zzxcjtmlnbb

    Materials (masterfiles and flattened maps, all in PSD as I do not know what format Nexuiz supports, anyway, you guys can convert them as necessary easily enough. Have a look at the included PSD masterfile so you guys can have a little idea of what goes on in making textures):

    http://www.mediafire.com/?wxegeozlziw

    Renders (with mock shirt/pants paintover):

    Image
    Image
    Image

    P.S. @ tonnedu, yes you can merge your baked normals with handmade normals, you don't need to use them separately. There are tutorials in the net for the that, but it's unnecessary in my case since I'm using purely handmade bump to normals anyway as Flying Steel said.

    And yes, our art director does it sometimes for making dents and some scratches, but it's minor stuff. If you make your metal too full of pits it will look organic which is not what you want anyway. And in the end, he also merges them together into one normal map. The handmade bump map is not used ingame (unless it's the only thing supported).

    P.P.S. for lighting I use max so the method is different. But I usually set up a skylight, turn on Final Gather and Global Illumination and add a directional light or two somewhere (such as the Sunlight I added here)

    P.P.P.S. I've always referred to Digitigrade legs as Ornithoid. :P LOL
    Last edited by Oblivion on Sat Sep 26, 2009 1:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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    Oblivion
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Sat Sep 26, 2009 1:57 pm

Sat Sep 26, 2009 2:43 pm

  • Impressive indeed, and I also downloaded and put them on my web host and they will always be available there, forever and ever.

    Browse link: http://ai.kurotorobert.com
    Direct link: http://ai.kurotorobert.com/nexuiz/model ... lFiles.zip

    Browse over to: nexuiz/models/Oblivion
    Unfortunately I had to create a .zip file for the mesh files and shove the .7z into the zip to include everything and still keep a small file size. If I had the Maps separated as a zip it would take 58 mb.
    The reason why I use zip is that the php browser I'm using isn't able to display .7z files making it impossible to know they are there.

    In the future I will change this if possible. This is very unfriendly, cannot even display .odt files (OpenOffice.org) and much much more.
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    ai
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Sat Sep 26, 2009 2:55 pm

  • Thanks, Oblivion for the lighting reply, I'll try your method! And, again.. Great model!! :D

    If I've time, in next week, I'll rig it
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    toneddu2000
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Sat Sep 26, 2009 3:27 pm

  • thanks doku and ai. and yw tonnedu. Also diabolik offered to animate it first (not sure if he also meant rigging) so I suggest talking with him also first. :)
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    Oblivion
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Sat Sep 26, 2009 4:17 pm

  • I have actually given Diabolik my skeleton which I'm using for the Nexus model, so I think he'll do the rigging. But dunno if he's going to create another one which suits that model better.
    But yeah, talk to him, if not on the forums then on IRC.

    Network: irc.anynet.org
    Channel: #alientrap

    He usually goes by the nick 'Dib'.
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    ai
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Sun Sep 27, 2009 9:31 am

Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:31 pm

  • Hey fella, that bot looks sick!, nice work.
    You still about?
    ...
    Look me up on irc:
    #nexuiz.editing
    ...
    I'll post again soon when i've added to this tiger chap, i got some nice ideas while i was away.
    ..
    Edit:
    I would really appreciate a look at your source texture files for this bot, is it apparent how you went about creating them from the source?
    ...
    im a bit blocked with old tiger chap atm, still thinking about it tho, finding it hard to get back to the state of mind i was in.
    fishsticks
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    Rad Ished
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Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:47 pm

  • Rad, hey. I ran into problems with your flameball .blend file. Everytime I export it from blender, it gives b0rked UV's and flipped normals. Can you please please export it to .obj? I can't figure out Blender. >.< Worst interface evar! LOL. Also the geom itself is rather... all over the place. :/

    Also my texture files posted earlier include a master file. Have a look at it. It's in PSD I think. :) And yes, I think you can figure out how I did it from the master file. I did the most basic stuff for the bot char.
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    Oblivion
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Fri Oct 09, 2009 1:28 pm

  • Hey Oblivion, here is the obj, i also added the material file i have no idea if you need this too.
    http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/83299681/file.html
    I hope it works for you. You said snthn about the geometry?
    ...
    Erm.. the mediafire link for the textures is broken now.. was i too slow :/ ?
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    Rad Ished
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Sun Nov 08, 2009 2:02 pm

  • Can't believe I didn't see this earlier. I have to say they are awesome :D Both the robot model and weapon samples in the first post. Imo Nexuiz would need weapon models like that for improving modernism... not to mention better player models especially robots.

    A huge +1 for committing the robot model... can't wait :) Just hope the textures won't be reduced to 512x512 this time, that does reduce quality a lot.
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    MirceaKitsune
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Sun Nov 08, 2009 4:05 pm

  • Sweet model! Why not contribute it to www.opengameart.org too ;)

    But in any case, this it definitely a big upgrade of the type Nexuiz needs most (nice playermodels)!!! Looking forward to see more of your work, and this funny bot in game!
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    Julius
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Sun Nov 08, 2009 5:52 pm

  • Julius wrote:Sweet model! Why not contribute it to www.opengameart.org too ;)


    Thank you for posting that link :D I didn't hope anyone made a site like that... it's very helpful.
    <Taoki> ... So maybe the new colored bars under the sbar weapons could indicate ammo level rather than accuracy stats.
    <Morphed> great now there is a place to show current phase of moon on hud
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    MirceaKitsune
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Tue Nov 17, 2009 12:07 pm

  • So what's the status of this? Any progress on getting it in the game? Hopefully this could be the first Nexuiz dpm model then ;)
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    Julius
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