Laser is primarily for moving, it is mainly a tool..a over-powered one at that, it isn't taken away from you completely, combo's fair enough, but same could be said for nex + mortar combo..you need to get both guns before you can do it.

Anyway, franco has designed the map like that, I will have another play on deck tomorrow, and with this feedback and that match go from there.

If so then it will only be one map, but franco has stated the reason why not to include it as a starting weapon.

I have played that map of his without it, and I have no problems, plenty of ways to get up high and there is mortar/electro jumps also if you dont have laser.

atheros please give the map a look before critising the idea and discover the path system that it offers before wanting to remove it because you cant make the usual laser-shotgun combo for 3 seconds after spawn (because yes, on this map there are lot of weapons close to you on purpose and also due its size). Its the WHOLE point of the map not to let you be anywhere you want, not to be able to collect all the weapons and armors in 1 laser-rush flying around

Kojn things like 25sec weapon respawn, starting without a laser is not a problem for you or other players at your skill level, but remember there are less skilled player in the tournament (that ofc includes me). A lot of the time I run around with only my shotgun and THE LASER I start with. Without the laser or a laser spawning every 25sec (which is the same as not having it because someone else will probably get it), I'm simply defenseless. I see you with a nex, I have only a shot gun, what are the chances to survive that without a laser, I could have used to push you away?

And plz stop arguing me that you can move without the laser - I know that and it's not the problem I see here.

To simply put it - shit like that gives yet an other advantage to more skilled players.

There is 2x nex's on deck, and only one on campgrounds.

However this isn't the argument.

You are at no more of a disadvantage then us at the start, or if we respawn though.

What you are saying is that you are presuming once we start fragging when you respawn you will be with only the shotgun right, so the skill difference will show even more?

I did not ask francotirador to remove laser as startup weapon, it was his choice I have played on the map, and I feel it was a good choice for that map.

Unlike deck, I do not think he will remove it from the map and give you it back as a startup weapon, after all it's only one map..I think you need to have a game vs some people on campgrounds first of all and see what you really think afterwards, but your concerns are noted!

k0jak wrote:What you are saying is that you are presuming once we start fragging when you respawn you will be with only the shotgun right, so the skill difference will show even more?

yes.

k0jak wrote:I did not ask francotirador to remove laser as startup weapon, it was his choice I have played on the map, and I feel it was a good choice for that map.

I didn't say that you did, if it's franco's choice to remove a weapon on his own map, who am I to argue. But does the fact that franco made that map means it has to go to the map pool? No.

k0jak wrote:Unlike deck, I do not think he will remove it from the map and give you it back as a startup weapon, after all it's only one map.

Unlike you said, it's not only one map! It makes 2 now!

k0jak wrote:I think you need to have a game vs some people on campgrounds first of all and see what you really think afterwards, but your concerns are noted!

Maybe I need, I didn't play it since you didn't give us a link. And I'm talking about deck, not about camping grounds.

If you want diversity, keep 1 of those exotic (aka not in nexuiz spirit) maps and kick the others.

Atheros wrote:yes.Maybe I need, I didn't play it since you didn't give us a link. And I'm talking about deck, not about camping grounds.

If you want diversity, keep 1 of those exotic (aka not in nexuiz spirit) maps and kick the others.

Atheros, I placed the laser in TDM to a much easier reachable place, if you really really need it. Also you wrote that you weren't given any link to test the map, well I will release the map beta version hopefully in 2-3 days (it wont have textures aligned and it will contain no lights and ambient sounds/smokes yet, so still beta). I don't really want to release any snapshot until its not absolutely final on this forum, but if this map gets into the map-pool for the tournament I certainly want to give people enough time to discover and learn the it, and get used to its no-startlaser FEATURE. On a map like Warfare you would certainly have huge disadvantage having no-laser, but here you have at least 5 points to move vertically higher on the map. Also due the buildup of the map you wouldn't be able to laserjump so so much anyway: maybe there are 3 places alltogether where you can use it for your advantage.

FraNcoTirAdoR wrote:Also due the buildup of the map you wouldn't be able to laserjump so so much anyway: maybe there are 3 places alltogether where you can use it for your advantage.

Note to the others: campgrounds-beta1 is now available for testing on affenbande.org (not in rotation, but votable)

Have fun....

deck map also has laser as start weapon now

k0jak wrote:deck map also has laser as start weapon now

10 points for kojn

20 points for FruitieX for first removing it (by demand), then adding it again (by demand).

Haha, just tried the campgrounds beta2. It indeed is a very accurate remake, how did you get it that close?

You should release it under the GPL2 and include the map sources if possible. Make it an open map project that is. It looks very dark at the moment, I could volunteer lighting it up better if it was GPL'd

Also, let me suggest the following: add

Code: Select all

#include physicsQ3.cfg


into the .mapinfo! Even the trickjump to the railgun is doable and just as hard as in q3 with those physics! You should maybe add the little black edge on the right for the "n00bs" (me) though
that #include line btw won't work in 2.5.1, but in 2.5.2 it will (and the tourney should be after 2.5.2 is out). I'm hoping this'll be the special map for the tourney

Edit: no start laser is great, please keep it that way. I would have voted this on the deck map too, but apparently people didn't like this.

FruitieX, +20 for you

FruitieX wrote:Haha, just tried the campgrounds beta2. It indeed is a very accurate remake, how did you get it that close?

With 1,5 month of work, working on it everyday ~5-6 hours Luckily I could keep most of the angles and also add some cool new one: look at the 50 armor in TDM from near the jumppad, you can just see it through the door unlike in quake 3, its a very nice tactical advantage.

FruitieX wrote:You should release it under the GPL2 and include the map sources if possible. Make it an open map project that is. It looks very dark at the moment, I could volunteer lighting it up better if it was GPL'd

I know it is very dark, but that okey: I wanna deal with lightning at the ending step, currently there is technically only the sky releasing light, and a special shader from the wall (thats why there are lot of light splashes yet). As soon as I have all the details up and textures aligned I will make very nice lights, you can trust in my design taste And I will release it under GPL, but before i share the .map file I wanna optimize it and clean it up as well as possible

FruitieX wrote:Also, let me suggest the following: add

Code: Select all

#include physicsQ3.cfg


into the .mapinfo! Even the trickjump to the railgun is doable and just as hard as in q3 with those physics! You should maybe add the little black edge on the right for the "n00bs" (me) though
that #include line btw won't work in 2.5.1, but in 2.5.2 it will (and the tourney should be after 2.5.2 is out). I'm hoping this'll be the special map for the tourney

I'm not sure the q3 physics wouldnt break most of the trickjumps, im optimizing those for the default nexuiz physics. Feel free to experiment with it FruitieX Here are some trickjump that are already on the map (im thinking lot to add many more).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRmsjot9p70

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOgRE_vG1n0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWZMZkr1O_E

FruitieX wrote:Edit: no start laser is great, please keep it that way. I would have voted this on the deck map too, but apparently people didn't like this.

Told ya all, this map does NOT need laser due its size and buildup ffs If you really need you can pick it up in TDM pretty easily, in DM mode it needs air strafing from the jumppad (i put to a harder place).

Well anyway, I'm still tweaking the map all the time, I will open a thread in the map releases for the current snapshot for testing, and it will be updated like every 2-3 days, and will be possible to provide feedbacks there
Ohh also, beta3 is coming to the server tonight (it doesnt mean anything, from alpha version i had 12 ), I added some ammo boxes, because with the tourney's 25 sec weapon spawn there were too ammo for the weapons. And made the jump to the laser a slightly easier from the jumppad, so now technically anyone can pick up without much difficulty.

There you go, 2on2 TDM Tourney players now have the opportunity to practice campgrounds redux, I opened a thread for it, that I will keep on updating with the newest version, feel free to practice, also note: if you are a weaker team and choose this map against a much harder opponent you will have better chance to win because they are not playing this map for years, they dont have well-practiced tactics on its yet

http://forums.alientrap.local/viewtopic.php?p=68712#68712

Enjoy

will this tourney ever start?

Yes, but for now it's on hold till the new version of nexuiz comes out. Were waiting on that.

In 4 days it will be 2 months since the topic started.

Like I said, we are waiting for the next release of nexuiz..it has been delayed quite a lot Atheros, was not expecting it to take this long, but i'm sure it won't be long now..please be patient. There's not much point doing anything else until it's out, interest will peak once the new version is out and this is the best time to start the tournament.

k0jak wrote:Like I said, we are waiting for the next release of nexuiz..it has been delayed quite a lot Atheros, was not expecting it to take this long, but i'm sure it won't be long now..please be patient. There's not much point doing anything else until it's out, interest will peak once the new version is out and this is the best time to start the tournament.

Well, erm, some definite date would be very useful to be able to plan other events. Like, erm, real life stuff

lda17h wrote:

k0jak wrote:Like I said, we are waiting for the next release of nexuiz..it has been delayed quite a lot Atheros, was not expecting it to take this long, but i'm sure it won't be long now..please be patient. There's not much point doing anything else until it's out, interest will peak once the new version is out and this is the best time to start the tournament.

Well, erm, some definite date would be very useful to be able to plan other events. Like, erm, real life stuff

Ask divVerent when 2.5.2 is out heh

That's the best I can do for now dude

k0jak wrote:Ask divVerent when 2.5.2 is out heh

Nobody knows... afaik there's one minor bug still open.

k0jak wrote:Like I said, we are waiting for the next release of nexuiz..it has been delayed quite a lot Atheros, was not expecting it to take this long, but i'm sure it won't be long now..please be patient. There's not much point doing anything else until it's out, interest will peak once the new version is out and this is the best time to start the tournament.

So?

I will announce news over this weekend

Imho we should wait for the patch for the bug on the water...

I agree, the 2.5.3 patch would be nice to have, water looks quite bad atm.

Still, it has been ages since the announcement of this tourney

Better late than never

Also its better to wait for the 2.5.3 version because of the machinegun and shotgun problems (and some with nex damage too), on closed maps weapon-domintation is pointless because shotgun uberpwnz everyone and everything on close range.

How long till 2.5.3?

Don't want to be waiting another month or it'll never get started.

k0jak wrote:How long till 2.5.3?

Don't want to be waiting another month or it'll never get started.

There isn't much watter in tourney maps but the MG and shotgun issue is a big problem. I made more frags recently with shotgun & MG than I did with the nex.

Agreed. Something has to be done about the SG and MG.