no sound in glx since installed new ubuntu
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Maybe there were legal reasons for that. fglrx is not GPL.1. Open Notepad
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You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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This is not a reason to release in such state. So patch Xorg if you can't patch fglrx.
Talking about alsa:
application -> alsa-lib pulseaudio backend-> pulseaudio server-> alsa hardware layer
instead of application -> alsa-lib -> alsa hardware layer. Of course, it's a matter or personal preference.- Alien
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There are good reasons NOT to use alsa-lib directly, and to have a sound server in between, namely ALSA's bad support for multiple sound sources on one sound device. "dmix" is known broken, and what else is there? Nothing.
So they made a sound server, hoping it does that in a better way.
Also, the sound server can be accessed by apps directly. This has the advantage that apps do not NEED to be specifically written for ALSA, which is for Linux only. A pulseaudio app can be used on many other operating systems too.
Now for non-pulseaudio apps, the path must be alsa-lib -> pulseaudio -> alsa-lib -> alsa-kernel and NOT alsa-lib -> alsa-kernel, as only one app can use the alsa sound output in the kernel at once for many sound cards.
Or do you think
alsa-lib -> pulseaudio -> alsa-lib -> dmix -> alsa-kernel
alsa-lib -> dmix -> alsa-kernel
is any better? That way, pulseaudio-using apps have to go through TWO sound mixers. That would be REALLY insane...1. Open Notepad
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You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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Alien wrote:This is not a reason to release in such state. So patch Xorg if you can't patch fglrx.
Who says it was even POSSIBLE to patch X.org for this? What if the change was a larger change in the architecture of X.org, and nothing that can be easily reverted? Then you'd be able to EITHER support old fglrx, OR support new drivers for new hardware.
No, in this case, ATI was clearly at fault for dropping support for old hardware. Halting X.org development just for an old legacy driver made by a company which refuses to update that driver is certainly not a solution.
Here you rather see why closed source drivers are bad.1. Open Notepad
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You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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This WAS not architecture related. It was just stupid driver X -version check, which WAS FIXED later. Everything happened because xorg changed numbering scheme and nobody at ati fixed their abandoned drivers. Far easier change was to change version output instead of blaming ati. End users do not care about this, they want working system (my windows were working, blah blah).- Alien
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I still see no reason for Ubuntu or ANY OTHER sane distro to mess with stuff like version number reporting (which IS important for when X.org have to deal bug reports by Ubuntu users) because some third party driver for outdated hardware is broken.
And what if another driver (e.g. the nvidia driver) checks for the NEW version number scheme, and will fail with the old one? What now?1. Open Notepad
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4. Open the file in Notepad again
You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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Ok, so it seems that the best thing is to leave users for their own fate. Sorry, I don't agree and don't want to argue more.- Alien
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?
A working driver for these cards is contained in X.org, which was why ATI discontinued support. Note that ATI discontinued support. Not Ubuntu.
So where is your problem? "BUT I WANT TO USE THAT DRIVER FROM ATI INSTEAD!!!!!!!!!eleven"?
BTW, same happened with nvidia. IIRC their legacy driver for Geforce 1 cards no longer compiles in current kernels (but I may be wrong with this). Are you expecting distributions to stay at old kernel versions so that legacy driver works?
Or, a case I have. I have an eeepc. To change the CPU speed, I need a special "eee" kernel module from http://code.google.com/p/eeepc-linux/ - but this module does not compile with Fedora's current kernel. Now is Fedora at fault for this? No, the authors of this module are, as well as the Linux Kernel developers for not keeping a stable API for drivers.1. Open Notepad
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4. Open the file in Notepad again
You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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At that time there was no 3d acceleration in oss driver (r300 is experimental).- Alien
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Alien wrote:At that time there was no 3d acceleration in oss driver (r300 is experimental).SavageX wrote:You are saying that it's not ATI/Nvidia's fault but write "cause ATI stopped the drivers development for older cards." The reasoning behind them (=ATI) stopping fglrx-development was that there are open-source drivers available already (with 3D support), so why not let user use those free drivers?
Now what? The open source drivers being "experimental" is no reason against, because, what software you use is NOT experimental?1. Open Notepad
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You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=900&num=1 wrote:While these benchmarks are not scientific and far from covering all of the different use cases for Compiz, to no real surprise the fglrx binary display driver does offer better performance than the reverse-engineered R300/400 support in the open-source Radeon driver. The only test where the fglrx driver had performed worse than the open-source alternative was when using the fire effect.- Alien
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Any newer release of fglrx can just as well reduce performance too and break compatibility. This happens all the time. Should Ubuntu then insist on shipping with the old driver - which has OTHER problems?
And again, this is not Ubuntu's task. Ubuntu's task is to deliver a working system using components made by others in as current as possible versions with as few modifications to the software as possible (instead, fixes should be pushed upstream to the software authors). Sometimes, as in this case, these goals cannot be fulfilled at once. If you insist on using legacy hardware, maybe you should be using a legacy distro. Support for old hardware being dropped happens all the time too - especially if its support is written by a third party so kernel developers do not adapt it when they change internal APIs.
I am not happy with this happening, but it DOES happen, and there is nothing a distribution can do about it. Just like it is not Ubuntu's fault that it won't boot on a 386 SX 16.1. Open Notepad
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You can vary the number of "MS", so you can clearly see it's MS which is causing it.-
divVerent - Site admin and keyboard killer
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Alien wrote:At that time there was no 3d acceleration in oss driver (r300 is experimental).
R300 (Radeon 9500 and up, Radeon 9000 and Radeon 9200 etc. are rebranded versions of R200) support still should be in fglrx. R200 and below was/is supported rather well in the open-source drivers.
Anyway, from what I gather your point is that there shouldn't be any situation in which a user is just dropped back to console because X failed to startup. BAAAAAM, now unexperienced users are eternally stuck because they cannot even surf the web to search for a solution. I agree, that shouldn't happen and it seems the Ubuntu developers agree as well. In newer Ubuntu versions there is BulletProof-X, which is something like an X "fail safe" mode which kicks in whenever starting normal X doesn't work.
So while one may argue that Ubuntu screws up some things they at least try to confine the problems arising if things break. Shit happens.-
SavageX - Site Admin
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Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:17 pm
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Its an easy fix I just did this:
sudo killall pulseaudio
sudo alsa force-reload
and then go to System>Preferences>Sound and change everything to ALSA
Now, back to fragging!- thedevnull
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Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:14 pm
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thedevnull wrote:Its an easy fix I just did this:
sudo killall pulseaudio
sudo alsa force-reload
and then go to System>Preferences>Sound and change everything to ALSA
Now, back to fragging!
are u sure that way of making it will make it persistent upon reboot ?-
liolak - Alien
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