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Nexuiz Etiquette: Type fragging

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Nexuiz Etiquette: Type fragging
Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:56 pm

  • Usually, I don't have a problem with this but sometimes, people simply wont make an effort to stay out of the way. For example, people who start typing in the middle of the fray and then complain when they die. Is it okay to type frag in these cases? How about in the extreme case of type fragging someone carrying a flag, keys, etc?
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:36 am

  • For me typefrags are ok in every situation...

    People who stand around writing in the middle of a fight WILL be fraged. If not from u then from someone else....

    In 1on1 its lame but everything else is ok

    My opinion
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 7:49 am

  • Typefragging when person is in the corner of his base is not ok for me.
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 8:59 am

  • People should type if they

      a) Spectate
      b) just died and didn't respawn yet
      c) are in their base in a corner or somewhere else


    Otherwise they will (or i do it) fragged. You can't type in the enemys base and other player do not kill you and then you grab the flag :P no way ;)
    if you type in the middle you can be fragged even by accident :) and don't blame people for a typefrag , its just 1 point :D and useless anyway.
    typing in a 1on1 is just stupid :D
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:02 pm

  • Sometimes you just need to respond to something that was written now.. either because the other guy might be leaving or maybe someone reacted wrong and you can't wait because then you would have to explain WHEN he did WHAT wrong :P

    Most of the time when people chat they either like to complain about teambalance or try to help anyone in some way so i generally think people that are CLEARLY chatting at the moment should not be fragged if possible!
    Sometime its however hard to quickly see someone is chatting. In huge maps it can happen that you see the enemy color and shoot an rocket without any chance to see the chatsign. Well thats bad luck then..
    Chatting in the enemy base however is really really a bad spot and i can understand if people frag there anyway. My personal point of view there is: If i think i can defend my base even with that guy around he might live.. that means Mirio: i would frag YOU if you were in my base as you are too good ^_^
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 6:01 pm

  • i can't even enter the base if you are defending ;) (seriously :D)
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 6:19 pm

  • Usil 666 wrote:
    typefragging imo is fair game, right of way goes to the fraggers
    not the typers
    its hard for me to respect someone who is offended by being killed in a videogame when they were voluntarily helpless
    you will never see me complain about being typefragged
    ever
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:46 pm

  • theres this wonderful thing called irc, use it, stop turning a fps into a chat room
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Sun Jan 11, 2009 10:31 pm

  • It's good to see that the consensus is more reasonable than I had thought. :)
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Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:43 am

  • Ah, gamesmanship: Community ruining antics.
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Mon Jan 12, 2009 12:33 pm

  • I try to avoid hitting people that type, in any case. This applies even when I am about to take the flag and somebody is typing in the enemy base near to the flag. If I accidentally frag or hit somebody that is typing, I apologize.

    When being hit or fragged while typing I usually just ignore it. What's the point of complaining? I am trying to be polite, and appreciate others to be polite but do not expect them to be.

    Exceptions are playing (serious) 1on1 matches or for example when I am hiding somewhere really far away from everything and some enemy sees me, walks up to me (those players rarely bunnyhop) and then frags me with a shotgun in my face while I am still typing. This is extremely seldom, as a) those players usually don't get as far as that, b) I am usually not typing THAT long and c) I usually don't get out of way much for typing anyway. :D

    I mean, it's a game, right?
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Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:24 pm

  • In ctf matches on the pubs I tend not to typefrag unless under specific conditions. If the enemy are sitting in my base typing, they die.

    If I have the flag and there is an enemy typing nearby, they die. Leaving them there would be a stupid risk.

    In CTF on the pubs I talk a lot, but I type extremely fast so it doesnt make too much of a difference.

    In 1v1's typing is a silly choice unless you are faaaarrr out of the way. Or dead.
    Possibly not the worst mapper in the world.

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Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:42 pm
Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:40 pm

  • well yeah ok in that case I really would typefrag, I guess. Though I might probably tease him with a single laser shot first so that the fc might stop typing and defend himself instead. I think I did that once already... but really, being fc and getting caught typing, that's really stupid.
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Mon Jan 12, 2009 5:22 pm

  • ai wrote:What would you do if an enemy had the flag and he was typing? Would you frag him/her?


    Yes. Typing with the flag is akin to suicide imo.
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Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:25 pm

  • Typefragging intentionally is really bad manners, with the exception of special situations (like enemy in the middle of your base).

    TwEaK wrote:theres this wonderful thing called irc, use it, stop turning a fps into a chat room


    You are hopefully aware that typing includes things like:

    * helping someone who is new to the game
    * just saying that 4 vs 8 is not really a balanced game
    * typing "vcall kickban permanent_teamfragger" in the console

    But I agree for people who really confuse Nexuiz with an IRC tool and start chatting about their favorite noodle dishes while playing on a full server. In that case typefragging them is ok in my opinion.



    Agama & Usil666 wrote:typefragging imo is fair game, right of way goes to the fraggers
    not the typers
    its hard for me to respect someone who is offended by being killed in a videogame when they were voluntarily helpless


    That makes me wonder why the devs implemented the keyboard symbol in the first place then. So if someone tries to improve the game play by kicking a trouble maker that gives you the right to frag him while being busy?

    It's hard for me to respect someone who has to frag typing people to increase his score.
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Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:41 pm

  • There is no real consensus. People should act the way their conscience says it is right.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:41 am

  • RoKenn wrote:That makes me wonder why the devs implemented the keyboard symbol in the first place then.

    To, uhm, signify when someone is chatting or has the console down? So you can that even though they're not moving, they're doing something?

    That argumentation is like saying "I wonder why the scoreboard displays the pings... hmm... it MUST be so you cut slack to players with bad connections". Well, no, not necessarily.

    So if someone tries to improve the game play by kicking a trouble maker that gives you the right to frag him while being busy?


    How can you automatically assume that every time it's something SUPER IMPORTANT like "kicking a trouble maker"? Why not assume it's something that probably could have waited until the player died "naturally", before respawning?

    Why not assume it's typing "LOL, I farted" for the 10th time?

    Seriously, what could one possible type that would deserve any protection? "DON'T SHOOT, IT'S A MISUNDERSTANDING?" But there is no game mode where that would be needed. There is NEVER ever something to negotiate with your enemies, and teammates usually don't shoot each other anyway.

    So.. uhm?

    Yes, if you typekill in a 1vs1 or other very small games you're an idiot. But that goes without saying. If someone in a big firefight stops to say "n1 haha" and gets killed (* that would usually be me) that is the natural flow of things and never a biggie.... if it IS a biggie, If you're that bad to get worked up over one death/frag typekillers are not your problem, and if you type that much to get typekilled all the time you should try IRC.

    IMHO, which happens to be correct. No consensus required.

    * I often stop to chat in the middle of a fight. It's idiotic, it's cocky, and I don't mind a bit when I get fragged while doing it. If anything, I feel it's bad sportmanship to be so easy prey!

    It's hard for me to respect someone who has to frag typing people to increase his score.

    What? You could say that when someone asks someone, then kills the dude replying.. but otherwise it's not like there's players hiding in the rafters to drop down for the kill as soon as someone starts to chat..
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:00 am

  • Fnilp wrote:
    RoKenn wrote:That makes me wonder why the devs implemented the keyboard symbol in the first place then.

    To, uhm, signify when someone is chatting or has the console down? So you can that even though they're not moving, they're doing something? ...


    There is only one possible use to the knowledge someone is typing, which is for others to avoid unsportsmanlike conduct.

    Fnilp wrote:... Why not assume it's typing "LOL, I farted" for the 10th time? ...


    Logical fallacy, the actual activity performed is irrelevant to the purpose of a notification.

    Fnilp wrote:... There is NEVER ever something to negotiate with your enemies, ...


    Keyhunt, the basis of the game mode is shifting alliances.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:37 am

  • TVR wrote:
    Fnilp wrote:
    RoKenn wrote:That makes me wonder why the devs implemented the keyboard symbol in the first place then.

    To, uhm, signify when someone is chatting or has the console down? So you can that even though they're not moving, they're doing something? ...


    There is only one possible use to the knowledge someone is typing, which is for others to avoid unsportsmanlike conduct.

    Actually Fnilp is correct here. The chat bubble only signifies that someone is "probably" doing something, with other words, typing. One could pull the console down and then go to the bathroom etc. (I used to do that) Which in this case didn't mean I typed or was active.
    However, the chat bubble doesn't necessarily have to mean 'Don't shoot me', even _if_ the devs implemented it with that goal in mind.
    There is and always will be more than one possible use of the chat bubble.

    But personally I say... How cares about typefrags anyway, it's rather stupid to care. It's a game, it's meant to kill people. This is always how I've thought about this and suppose always will. But I do conduct in a rather 'respectable' manner anyway.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:49 am

  • Fnilp wrote:
    RoKenn wrote:That makes me wonder why the devs implemented the keyboard symbol in the first place then.

    To, uhm, signify when someone is chatting or has the console down? So you can
    that even though they're not moving, they're doing something?

    That argumentation is like saying "I wonder why the scoreboard displays the pings... hmm... it MUST be so you cut slack to players with bad connections". Well, no, not necessarily.


    The ping actually is used, for example to find a 1on1 server on which both players have a similar ping. Or to tell a noob that his ping is bad and he might want to find a server with lower ping for him.

    Fnilp wrote:
    So if someone tries to improve the game play by kicking a trouble maker that gives you the right to frag him while being busy?


    How can you automatically assume that every time it's something SUPER IMPORTANT like "kicking a trouble maker"? Why not assume it's something that probably could have waited until the player died "naturally", before respawning?

    Why not assume it's typing "LOL, I farted" for the 10th time?


    I do not assume that it's always something important. Did you search for the word "noodle" in my article? Obviously not, do it now. :roll:

    Fnilp wrote:Seriously, what could one possible type that would deserve any protection? "DON'T SHOOT, IT'S A MISUNDERSTANDING?" But there is no game mode where that would be needed. There is NEVER ever something to negotiate with your enemies, and teammates usually don't shoot each other anyway.


    You forgot to read my list of examples. Should I post them again? ^^

    Fnilp wrote:
    It's hard for me to respect someone who has to frag typing people to increase his score.

    What? You could say that when someone asks someone, then kills the dude replying.. but otherwise it's not like there's players hiding in the rafters to drop down for the kill as soon as someone starts to chat..


    You realized that my last sentence was an ironic reply to the quote above, did you? Aw, no, you didn't. :(

    Next time, please read and understand a post before you reply.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:58 am

  • ai wrote:One could pull the console down and then go to the bathroom etc. (I used to do that) Which in this case didn't mean I typed or was active.


    And? It's also good manners not to typefrag you while you are ... answering nature's call. With exceptions as usual of course (by accident, because you are standing in the middle of the battlefield, you have the flag...).

    PS: Of course, it's also not good manners to go for a phone chat with your best friend, while you have the flag :P
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:25 am

  • ai wrote:How cares about typefrags anyway, it's rather stupid to care. It's a game, it's meant to kill people.


    I think in general, type-fragging is disrespectful. Currently you can only make assumptions about what they are doing. However, if they pose no harm (they're out of the way or have their head in the corner), why kill them? Share the respect, the game is about fun. I don't believe calling something a game is a good reason to think manners don't exist. Don't forget you're playing with other humans.


    On another note, this may bring about discussion on how to further improve the chat icon. For example changing the color of the key icon above the player's head based on:
    a) the amount of time they've been typing
    b) the length of what they are typing
    c) # of times they've spoken per match

    I'm not sure how possible this is but dynamically sizing chat bubbles and displaying the first few words above a players head is an interesting concept.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:58 am

  • I actually never considered or thought typefragging is disrespectful until I found Nexuiz, which was weird for me when people got mad about that, as it still were 'just a game'. One can pick up the weapons one have again, and the armor and go into position (from wherever the person was typing) again. And if it was an important position then don't type there in the first place.
    Getting typefragged is your own fault, and ONLY your own fault, not the fraggers.

    This is what I first thought and felt before I joined Nexuiz, and I still to really. But because I'm nice I'm willing to bend on my behavior. However, on rare occasions I get back to my old self, in intense battle and whatnot, then I just don't care what that typing person does.
    I'm more likely to kill the better players then the newbies. I kinda wanna keep their experience as best as I can. I'm a newbie friendly guy. ^_^
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:45 pm

  • Someone gave a perfect example above and as a server admin, I must agree. If I'm working to improve the server and someone type-frags me, I get very offended. It's not always as simple as "regaining your weapons" which can take a few minutes... and if I'm testing things it's very annoying and time consuming.

    "It's a game" is a poor excuse, especially for an open-source game where community is the focal point.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:44 pm

  • Well, a game is still a game, people (usually) play them to have fun and blow off some steam (unless you're a professional player who plays for money). If someone is testing stuff then going public you do take a chance of getting typefragged. Put up a special server and invite people to to test it out with you if your afraid of getting typefragged. A public server is for anyone joining and start killing people. One cannot join such a server and expect to be treated with utmost respect and carefulness just because you are 'testing' stuff.

    However, typefrags doesn't necessarily mean that someone disrespects you, in fact, it's careless to even clump 'disrespect' with typefrag. I sometimes frag people that type, yet I don't disrespect them any less. Nor that typefrags would affect the community as a whole.
    I'm actually offended when people do get offended by getting typefragged, as that is a risk everyone takes when joining a server.
    It like you take a risk getting into an accident every time you climb into a car and start driving.
    For me it is a game, and it will always be 'just a game', where I join and play just to have fun. 'Just a game' is not a poor excuse, saying 'it's just a game' doesn't signify that the community is bad or that you even imply that. Those words are only focusing on the game, the community has nothing to do with that.

    Now, I'm not saying people should start killing people that type, I'm just saying getting typefragged is not a big deal, is not the end of the world, it happens and it's definitely not something that _anyone_ should take offense over, if they do, they take the game too seriously. (This is my opinion)
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:01 pm

  • okay, I'll just take my servers offline instead of getting live feedback from users next time I want to make changes so I don't get typefragged.
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Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:08 pm

  • I usually avoid shooting ppl typing, if i can. FC and enemies in my base excluded. If someone takes a shot at me while im typing alive, that's my problem. The only time i get a bit ticked is if i went obviously out of the way to type in a ctf game (i dont care in dm-like mode, those are frag oriented. i try not to tf myself, but that's just me). and someone walk up and shoots me.

    of course the person shooting at a typer cant know if hes target is giving team orders, configuring the server or typing AHAHA GAY TEAM)))

    Also, there's the flipside of this; when you avoid shooting a chatter and then he finish chatting (or cancels) and pumps your back full of led just as you pass. This bugs me more then getting typefraged tbh.

    So my point of view: don't type while alive if this bugs you.

    [-z-] wrote:okay, I'll just take my servers offline instead of getting live feedback from users next time I want to make changes so I don't get typefragged.


    So a getting fraged one or twice matters more then the configuring? Then maybe you should go spectator or rcon while doing that. Sorry i dont get it, i mean the main reason for a game server must be playing on it, no?
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Wed Jan 21, 2009 12:25 pm

  • [-z-] wrote:"It's a game" is a poor excuse


    I use the "excuse" that way: it's a game, so why the heck should I mind if I am getting typefragged? But if other players mind, well, then why should I frag them while they are typing? Fragging somebody that types doesn't mean a thing to me, it is no fun at all and fun is what I play for.

    Plus, not fragging typers usually is regarded as good sportsmanship - which, as I feel, greatly enhances the game atmosphere.
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typefragging whiners are really annoying
Fri May 29, 2009 5:58 am

  • I used to go past ppl who were typing, then they would finish typing and shoot me in the back. Now I just kill anyone who gets in my way.

    Stopping to type, then resuming when the enemy has their back to you and fragging them is just so lame that it should be discouraged at every turn.

    On my server, typefragging is expressly ENCOURAGED, because the ppl who complain about it complain about everything, and are sore losers anyway.

    Here is the rule: If you are in the arena, you are fair game. I don't set forced respawn in CTF, so die already if you want to finish your in-game essay. Otherwise, turn the safety off and start shooting.

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